Monkey Man
|
| posted on 14/5/06 at 10:20 PM |
|
|
Silly questions on fuel system.
Having the engine in the car I am trying to get the fuel system sorted out.
I have the haynes manual but it really hasn't helped me work out what is supposed to connect to what.
Here is a picture of my carb with five connectors. I'm not sure which is which or what they are for. The fifth one is just above the oil
filter.
As far as I am aware I want the fuel pipe to connect to the vapour separatpr which should have the return pipe attach back to the hose that attaches
to the tank. The third hose should attach to a fuel filter which should attach to the bottom of the fuel pump which is just visible in the bottom left
corner of that shot. The top of the fuel pump should attach to the carb. I don't know which one though and I don't know what any of the
others are for! I took the engine out last year and have only just got around to putting it all back together.
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
|
|
|
|
|
omega0684
|
| posted on 15/5/06 at 09:27 AM |
|
|
sorry but cant help, BIG UP PINTO POWER!
I love Pinto's, even if i did get mine from P&O!
|
|
|
Monkey Man
|
| posted on 16/5/06 at 11:52 AM |
|
|
Go on. Someone must have some idea about carburettors 
|
|
|
pajsh
|
| posted on 16/5/06 at 12:30 PM |
|
|
I have two similar DFTH carbs one from a 1.6L pinto (28/32 I think) and one from a 2.0L (32/36 have to check the Haynes manual to be sure). Yours
looks similarish to my 2.0 one but mine has had the stepper motor (LHS) removed. Other than identifying the carb the Hanyes was no help.
I struggled to find information too and in the end got the 1.6 carb complete with manifold etc as for some reason my 1.6 had the 2.0 carb on it.
There are plenty of people with pintos who should be able to help but if no one else chips in I can take some pictures tonight and post them tomorrow.
I used to be apathetic but now I just don't care.
|
|
|
Monkey Man
|
| posted on 16/5/06 at 01:13 PM |
|
|
A few pictures would be great. Thanks. 
I had the same problem as you with the haynes manual. It assumes everything is already connected up.
"Refitting is the opposite of removal."
If anyone else wants to make some pinto porn and show me their hoses I won't object.
|
|
|
flak monkey
|
| posted on 16/5/06 at 01:18 PM |
|
|
Fuel inlet is the largeish brass one on the carb.
The large outlet on the manifold is the heater matrix water take off. Plug that up if you arent going to have a heater.
One of the small connections on the manifold is the vacuum advance that should be connected to the dizzy.
Dunno what the others are for at the moment.
Sera
http://www.motosera.com
|
|
|
James
|
| posted on 16/5/06 at 01:59 PM |
|
|
I was advised by everyone to bin the stepper motor carb- that it's a piece of junk!
Get yourself a nice straightforward 32/36!
If you insist with staying with this one. I've used the water outlet to feed my header tank (via the choke) rather than blanking it off!
The red wire is +12v in for an electric manifold heater element.
The bottom right (next to dipstick) brass connector is brake servo take off I believe.
God only know what wires you put to the stepper motor. I know there's 6 or 8 of them!  Does it have/need the ECU to run these?
Cheers,
James
[Edited on 16/5/06 by James]
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"The fight is won or lost far away from witnesses, behind the lines, in the gym and out there on the road, long before I dance under those lights."
- Muhammad Ali
|
|
|
britishtrident
|
| posted on 16/5/06 at 02:02 PM |
|
|
Don't plug off the water outlet on the manifold this is the by-pass connection. If you run without it the thermstat won't control the
water temperature properly it should run back to the connection on the water pump water pump inlet.
|
|
|
flak monkey
|
| posted on 16/5/06 at 02:03 PM |
|
|
Think it needs the ecu to work. Better off upgrading properly and fitting a 38DGAS.
I have one of theseold electronic carbs and manifolds sitting in the shed. Might have gone down the tip actually!
Sera
http://www.motosera.com
|
|
|
britishtrident
|
| posted on 16/5/06 at 02:04 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by James
I was advised by everyone to bin the stepper motor carb- that it's a piece of junk!
Get yourself a nice straightforward 32/36!
If you insist with staying with this one. I've used the water outlet to feed my header tank rather than blanking it off!
The red wire is +12v in for an electric manifold heater element.
The bottom right (next to dipstick) brass connector is brake servo take off I believe.
God only know what wires you put to the stepper motor. I know there's 6 or 8 of them! Does it have/need the ECU to run these?
Cheers,
James
I got a manual choke conversion kit for my Weber --- don't know if you can get it for this model of carb, but mine was nos of ebay.
|
|
|
James
|
| posted on 16/5/06 at 02:15 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by britishtrident
quote:
Originally posted by James
James
I got a manual choke conversion kit for my Weber --- don't know if you can get it for this model of carb, but mine was nos of ebay.
Ok. My water outlet goes via the 32/36 choke up to the header tank. But I may well be going to ditch the choke altogether and just go straight to the
header tank.
Cheers,
James
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"The fight is won or lost far away from witnesses, behind the lines, in the gym and out there on the road, long before I dance under those lights."
- Muhammad Ali
|
|
|
Macbeast
|
| posted on 16/5/06 at 04:37 PM |
|
|
I just had a look at my Sierra 1.6 Pinto.
Firstly, my carb is 180 deg round from yours, ie the round thing on the left in your pic saying Weber ( secondary throttle valve vacuum unit ) is
facing the camshaft cover on mine. Don't suppose it matters but obviously connections to the carb would be routed differently.
So, on your pic, the top right vertical
connector pointing downwards is the fuel in.
the one below and slightly to the right is prob the vacuum to the brake servo.
The one below that to the left that looks as if it has red wire to it ( but doesn't) is the return from the heater.
I don't have one like you at the bottom left of the round thing saying Weber
nor do I have one like you half way between the fuel inlet and the return from heater - the one that looks as if it has a black flexible pipe coming
from below.
On mine, there is a mess of flexipipework going to what would be the other side of your pic, between carb and camshaft cover. I think this is all tied
up with crankcase breather, emission control etc.
The big problem seems to be that there are many variants, presumably cos Ford bodged solutions to new emission regulations.
I think the fuel routing is tank to pump to fuel regulator / vapour separator to carb, with return to tank from the third thinner connection on the
fuel separator
Good luck - SU would be simpler 
[Edited on 16/5/06 by Macbeast]
|
|
|
pajsh
|
| posted on 16/5/06 at 04:50 PM |
|
|
What does the stepper motor actually do? Can you not just take it off?
My 2.0l carb (32/36) with it removed did run on the 1.6 but at the time I didn't have a prop shaft so never tried it under load. Seemed to be
very rich and occasionally shot flames out the top but I put that down to timing. Webcon said it wouldn't run at all.
In the end I took the easy route and just swapped it for the proper 1.6 carb c/w manifold and correct plumbing.
The guy I bought the (half complete) car off builds F2 stock cars and he said he could use the 32/36 on his pinto. Guess they must have rules that say
they have to use standard carbs in some classes.
I seemed to be able to get info on DGAS and DMTL but not much on DFTH. Is there a reason for this?
I wired up the electric choke and it works fine but I plan to change it as soon as I get time.
I used to be apathetic but now I just don't care.
|
|
|
Monkey Man
|
| posted on 16/5/06 at 05:51 PM |
|
|
Thanks for all the replies. I now know more and am more confused than when I started.
You've mentioned getting a different carburettor what model number?
ebay?
Is the ecu needed? I still have it as I wasn't sure but I thought you could get away without it.
I'm going to do a bit more investigation and come back when I have some better thought out and less general questions.
|
|
|
Monkey Man
|
| posted on 16/5/06 at 10:06 PM |
|
|
O.K.
My distributor has an electric socket on it so presumably the ignition advance is controlled by the ecu.
The wiring loom I got from MK doesn't have the necessary attachments.
I do still have the original loom though so could cut the relevent section out.
So whats the concensus? Try to get the current one working ecu and all or buy a new carb and distributor which doesn't use electronic jiggery
pokery?
|
|
|
Macbeast
|
| posted on 16/5/06 at 10:46 PM |
|
|
I would think the simplest is stick with what you've got. Otherwise, if you change the distributor, you have to change and wire the ECU and work
out how to obtain the vacuum advance.
[Edited on 16/5/06 by Macbeast]
|
|
|
Monkey Man
|
| posted on 17/5/06 at 04:04 PM |
|
|
I think you're probably right. I'll stick with what I've got and see if I can get it going.
O.K. So far we've identified
1) water outlet to connect to the top of the water pump.
2) Fuel inlet which takes fuel from the vapour separator which in turn connects back to the hose which the fuel is coming down before it gets to the
fuel pump.
Of the remaining three it seems as though one could be for the brake servo and can be blanked off. Don't know which yet though.
A friend suggested the one coming from underneath (which has a hose which connects to a small cylindrical thing which appears to be plumbed into the
engine block) could be a crank case breather and expects to take small amounts of crap out and dump them into the carb to be burnt.
A vacuum advance mechanism for the distributor has been suggested but as it has an electrical socket on it I can discount this and assume the advance
is calculated by the ecu right?
There is also a small tube that comes off the ecu presumably this should connect to one of the pipes and is what provides the ecu with the info to
tell the distributor how much the spark should be advanced by.
Does that sound a bit closer?
Thanks for all your input. I'm a total novice at all this stuff so your help really is invaluable.
|
|
|
pajsh
|
| posted on 18/5/06 at 09:38 AM |
|
|
As I said I would post some pictures so here is one. There are more in my archive.
 
Weber 2.0 DFTH 32/36 Connections
My 2.0 carb is different and has many more pipes and I don't know what they all do but they seem to be mostly vaccum pipes. I've covered
most of them in the picture.
I think sticking with what you have got is a good idea or do what I did in stripping a complete carb & manifold of a similar car in the scrappy
and bolting it on.
Pics of my 1.6 DFTH 28/32 also in my archive. Again slightly different but the main pipes are all the same.
Yes I blanked off the servo as I am using a non servo master cylinder.
Yes the water hose connects direct to the water pump instead of going via the heater matrix.
Yes the crank case breather connects as shown.
For vacuum advance a mate of mine has 2.0 pinto and his vacuum pipe connects to the ECU so this may explain where that goes. Then the electrical
connection is from the ECU to the dizzy.
The mass of pipes under the manifold connect to two thermal switches which presumably open when the water in the manifold reaches the right temp. I
think they must just fine tune for economy and emmisions.
As it was a 2.0l carb on a 1.6 engine and I couldn't find anything out I just went and got a replacement that works fine.
Bike carbs seem to be the way to go long term.
HTH.
I used to be apathetic but now I just don't care.
|
|
|
Marcus
|
| posted on 18/5/06 at 10:18 AM |
|
|
A nice simple carb is the 38DGAS or DGMS
It's a popular upgrade to the pinto, so you should be able to pick one up for very little money. I sold one on eBay last year for 45 including
manifold and filter.
It was originally fitted to the 3 litre Capri / Granada, so may need re jetting for a pinto.
Marcus
Marcus
Because kits are for girls!!
|
|
|
flak monkey
|
| posted on 18/5/06 at 10:28 AM |
|
|
DGAS's are fetching stupid money at the moment. One went last week on ebay for £120 including manifold and K&N....!!
I will be selling mine shortly once I have got the DCOEs sorted...
David
Sera
http://www.motosera.com
|
|
|
