rich201283
|
| posted on 30/12/09 at 06:00 AM |
|
|
Sylva Star?
Hi
Im on the verge of buying a Sylva Star that has been garaged for 20yrs, How well do these cars handle & perform? Are they normally put togeather
well? I will be changing the engine from viva to zetec.
Regards Lee
|
|
|
|
|
zilspeed
|
| posted on 30/12/09 at 09:05 AM |
|
|
I have done this conversion before -
Zetec into Sylva Star.
That was with my first Star, I am now on my 2nd car, which sort of looks like a Leader, but is really a Star.
Anyway, Zetec into a star.
Bolt a Zetec to type 9.
Remove the small 1" square tube from the bottom of the front of the transmission tunnel.
Crane the engine and box into place.
The gearlever will fit exactly into the hole in the tunnel which the vauxhall one used to fit into.
Uses some 25mm square tube to fabricate a rear gearbox mount, just a straight bit onto the main chassis tubes and the Sierra gearbox mount.
Engine mounts are up to you, but it's easy.
You will not have to cut the bonnet at all but may not to very slightly thin the grp a tiny amount to clear the timing belt cover.
The rest, follow your nose.
Here's mine, and welcome.
 
AnotherAv
 
Sylva at home
 
Description
And here's what you're likely to find after years lying unused.
 
Empty / messy engine bay
I think they perform very well, but I would say that - I've had two.
A Sylva Star uses Viva front hubs which are meant to be bolted to wishbones and the geometry of them therefore suits that. This means that the
front end works properly. A whole load of cars use Sierra hubs, which really don't compare at all.
Then there's the issue of wheels. These cars work best on modestly wide 13" wheels, your Sylva will almost certainly sit on a set of these
and as a result will work.
As I said previously, I'm biased, but a little Sylva running a reasonbly strong engine is certainly a useful car.
[Edited on 30/12/09 by zilspeed]
|
|
|
snapper
|
| posted on 30/12/09 at 09:16 AM |
|
|
Kit cars are only as well put together as the person who built them, as kit cars are generally built by individuals there is no generic build quality
as such, certainly with some kits the general quality of the kit of parts is very good but something 20 years old constructed before any tests such as
SVA and IVA had only an MOT standard to achieve could be considered less well constructed than todays kits.
The more you know about the cars history and the previous owners the better, if its free or very very cheap you have nothing to loose at this stage
but there are a lot of more modern part builds available
I don't know anything about the Silva star but Viva parts probably means Viva suspension and Viva handling.
Changing the engine and gearbox could be an issue if the car is a fiberglass monocoque as the Viva engine and Viva gearbox where very very small,
smaller than the Ford crossflow and type E box.
Do a bit more research before committing yourself.
I eat to survive
I drink to forget
I breath to pi55 my ex wife off (and now my ex partner)
|
|
|
snapper
|
| posted on 30/12/09 at 09:18 AM |
|
|
Zilspeed beat me to the posts and has much better info.
I eat to survive
I drink to forget
I breath to pi55 my ex wife off (and now my ex partner)
|
|
|
Volvorsport
|
| posted on 30/12/09 at 09:57 AM |
|
|
if you pass it up , ill have a looksie .
zilspeed is correct , when launched the sylva star was cheap and competent .
treat it as you would any other old car thats been stored in a barn , but just extra extra caution
www.dbsmotorsport.co.uk
getting dirty under a bus
|
|
|
rich201283
|
| posted on 30/12/09 at 10:30 AM |
|
|
Well the car is up for £1000ono - Do you think this is over priced? It is compleate but could do with a new hood.
|
|
|
zilspeed
|
| posted on 30/12/09 at 10:50 AM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by rich201283
Well the car is up for £1000ono - Do you think this is over priced? It is compleate but could do with a new hood.
It would have to be really quite nice to be worth that to me.
In other words a car that is all up and running having had all of the brakes attended to, new pipes and flexis throughout, everything else that will
have deteriorated in the years of inactivity. Carbs expecially will be in need of refurbishing and the fuel tank will need flushing to get rid of the
crap which has accumulated (ask me how I know...)
I would suggest that absolute top money is maybe £2000-2500 for a fully MOT'd car running a strong xflow or a basic zetec with fresh tyres and
decent wheels with good interior and dash.
Mine is an oddball now having the bike engine, so I have no clue as to the value of that.
Anyway, back to the point.
Provided the car is correctly registered (not a foregone conclusion) it certainly will have an inherent base value purely because of that. If the
bodywork is good, add a bit for that.
It's sat for 20 years, so I suggest that you're more than a couple of weekends work away from an MOT.
On that basis, I would suggest that £1000 is very strong money, but I'm very very tight.
I paid £650 for mine as you see it in the pics above. In the pics on the hill, it was as you see it in the pics. Subsequent stripdown revealed what
you see in the last picture.
You must especially get under the back of the car to check the condition of the chassis tubes. There's no oil or grease to keep them from
rusting and the paint won't have lasted. To properly de rust and paint this, you need to remove the roll bar followed by the rear bodywork
section. I haven't seen your car, but would be amazed if you didn't have to do this.
I'm not suggesting that any of this is a deal breaker, but you must pay the right price. Any old basket case can easily be made to lookl tidy on
top with a Star of Leader, but look underneath. That's where the truth lies.
|
|
|
rich201283
|
| posted on 30/12/09 at 11:11 AM |
|
|
Thanks for the info, I am prepared to do the de-rusting, I have only ever done a Dutton phaeton part restore. i can weld okay and have the tools. The
car body work is supposed to be good and not faded which is a bonus.
|
|
|
MikeRJ
|
| posted on 30/12/09 at 11:47 AM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by snapper
I don't know anything about the Silva star but Viva parts probably means Viva suspension and Viva handling.
Does that mean that all Locosts handle like Cortinas and Sierras?
The Star was one of Jeremy Philips creations, not exactly someone renown for designing badly handling cars!
[Edited on 30/12/09 by MikeRJ]
|
|
|
zilspeed
|
| posted on 30/12/09 at 01:12 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by MikeRJ
quote:
Originally posted by snapper
I don't know anything about the Silva star but Viva parts probably means Viva suspension and Viva handling.
Does that mean that all Locosts handle like Cortinas and Sierras?
The Star was one of Jeremy Philips creations, not exactly someone renown for designing badly handling cars!
[Edited on 30/12/09 by MikeRJ]
Whilst I agree with the sentiment, if the car handles well (which I think it does) that's in part down to good fortune.
The front subframe is lifted as is from the Viva and bolted in. Springs are shortened.
The back axle is bolted in with some slightly modified trailing arms.
Nevertheless, back in the day Sylvas regularly won kit car races and also did well against more expensive competition in speed events.
Provided the original poster buys well, he won't go far wrong. As I said above, I reckon there's a couple of grand in one that's in
good order.
That's a better return than most people would experience for their money.
|
|
|
MikeRJ
|
| posted on 30/12/09 at 01:39 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by zilspeed
Whilst I agree with the sentiment, if the car handles well (which I think it does) that's in part down to good fortune.
Reckon he must have got lucky with every car he made then! 
|
|
|
zilspeed
|
| posted on 30/12/09 at 01:48 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by MikeRJ
quote:
Originally posted by zilspeed
Whilst I agree with the sentiment, if the car handles well (which I think it does) that's in part down to good fortune.
Reckon he must have got lucky with every car he made then!
The difference is that every car since the Star and Leader has had much more of a design element to the suspension.
Having said that, the rear chassis design of a Fisher Fury recently for sale on here was awfully similar to my 27 year old Star.
|
|
|
Memphis Twin
|
| posted on 30/12/09 at 02:48 PM |
|
|
The Star and Leader, whilst being built from pretty mundane running gear, are much more than a sum of their parts.
In the mid 90s I used to hillclimb and sprint with a 1700 x-flow powered Leader with quite a bit of success against the Caterham/Westfield
competition. The forward mid-engined layout, and the seating position well ahead of the rear axle line led to brilliant handling with extreme
"chuckability".
I sold my car and invested in a Striker, which although being 100kg lighter and therefore faster in a straight line, didn't handle quite as well
as the Leader (in my opinion). I also used to take great delight in humbling £12000 Cateringvans with the Leader, which even with a potent 1700
X-Flow, LSD and fully adjustable suspension still only owed me £2000! I wish I'd invested in some lightweight bodywork, (had a lightweight
bonnet) and had a go at the chassis with an angle grinder in a bid to save weight, and I reckon I'd have kept and developed it to be a real
giant killer.
Crikey, if I had a spare £1000 I'd be beating a path to the vendors door right now...
Cheers Chris.
|
|
|
bmseven
|
| posted on 30/12/09 at 04:08 PM |
|
|
Love em, its undergoing a bit of a facelift at the mo gone are the seats amongst other things, just no current photos
BMW 7 Resource
Bures Pit anyone?
|
|
|
rich201283
|
| posted on 1/1/10 at 11:27 AM |
|
|
Hi i finally bought it, But nothing like the £1000 it was advetised for.
The car only has minor surface rust on the chassis.
Brakes will need refurbished and will start removing the engine and gearbox tommorow.
I cannot decide wether to zetec it or bike engine it, Can anyone advise on how reliable Bec cars are?
|
|
|
David Jenkins
|
| posted on 1/1/10 at 12:27 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by rich201283
I cannot decide wether to zetec it or bike engine it, Can anyone advise on how reliable Bec cars are?
Anyone got any popcorn? 
|
|
|
zilspeed
|
| posted on 1/1/10 at 01:02 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by David Jenkins
quote:
Originally posted by rich201283
I cannot decide wether to zetec it or bike engine it, Can anyone advise on how reliable Bec cars are?
Anyone got any popcorn?
Well, I've done both of those things to that chassis.
EDU ***K had a Zetec engine.
BXE ***M is having a ZX10 engine.
Just make a choice and go for it, it's your call entirely.
What I would say is that when we did the zetec conversion around 1996 or so, megajolt or megasquirt was unheard of as were bike carb conversions. You
gave Dunnell a cheque for £400 quid for an ignition ECU, it was the only choice.
From start to finish, I think we took a grand total of 6 weeks to have the job 100% complete.
The bike conversion is taking me huge amounts longer, but that's my fault, nothing to do with the conversion.
As I said above, just go for it, but please bear in mind that the peculiarities of a Star chassis means that it will swallow a Zetec and type 9 way
easier than it will accept a bike engine. Blame the Viva crossmember.
|
|
|
Memphis Twin
|
| posted on 1/1/10 at 01:47 PM |
|
|
I'd stick to a 4-pot car engine, and try and save weight wherever possible. The Star chassis is quite a heavy-rugged piece of kit, but there are
areas where you can lose many kilos of weight.
As an aside, I don't know if you want to compete in the car, but the Leader/Star is accepted as a Modified Production Car by the MSA with any
Ford, Fiat or Vauxhall 4 cylinder engine.
Of course a lot of clubbie type events specifically ban spaceframe-type cars from Modprods so you'd run against the plethora of
"Locaterfields" in the kitcar classes.
|
|
|
rich201283
|
| posted on 1/1/10 at 02:07 PM |
|
|
I am going to go with a 2ltr zetec with bike carbs. I already have a set of zx6 carbs and a megajolt kit.
Does anyone know what modern alloys will fit and what size is the best?
Also how easy is it to remove the rear tub?
|
|
|
zilspeed
|
| posted on 2/1/10 at 10:06 AM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by rich201283
I am going to go with a 2ltr zetec with bike carbs. I already have a set of zx6 carbs and a megajolt kit.
Does anyone know what modern alloys will fit and what size is the best?
Also how easy is it to remove the rear tub?
Wheel PCD is 4", which is 101.8mm.
This is perilously close to 100mm and you might be tempted to try some 100mm PCD wheels from a Vauxhall or a 4 stud VW, but they really don't
fit.
Mine sits on Compomitives and I also have some Alycats, I would be quite happy to have some good old Revolutions, like in the picture further up the
thread.
Best size ? 6J x 13 with 185/60 x 13" tyres.
Removing the rear tub.
You will need to first remove the roll bar. Chances are it will have been bolted on with mild steel bolts which will now have rusted solid. Once these
are off, you have some mounting bolts to remove, some rivets inside the boot to drill out and some screws inside the front of the wheelarch moldings
to drill out because these will also be rusted solid.
(Rusty rear chassis rails ?)
|
|
|
MikeRJ
|
| posted on 2/1/10 at 12:08 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by zilspeed
Wheel PCD is 4", which is 101.8mm.
This is perilously close to 100mm and you might be tempted to try some 100mm PCD wheels from a Vauxhall or a 4 stud VW, but they really don't
fit.
You could use "wobble bolts" to sort this, though I'm not really a fan of them.
|
|
|
zilspeed
|
| posted on 2/1/10 at 12:31 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by MikeRJ
quote:
Originally posted by zilspeed
Wheel PCD is 4", which is 101.8mm.
This is perilously close to 100mm and you might be tempted to try some 100mm PCD wheels from a Vauxhall or a 4 stud VW, but they really don't
fit.
You could use "wobble bolts" to sort this, though I'm not really a fan of them.
In my case,it was revolutions with sleeve nuts. Wobble bolts wouldn't have solved that problem.
If you look around there are plenty of wheels avaialble though.
Minis are 4" PCD, so Minilites are available brand new as are Revolutions.
|
|
|
rich201283
|
| posted on 3/1/10 at 10:03 AM |
|
|
The rear chssis rails only has minor surface rust, everything is solid and in really good condition, Engine should be out today, Then im gonna unbolt
the front subframe and clean, rebush, paint. Been lookin a bit more into engines and the saab 2.0 turbo engine seems to be an option with the calrton
box.
|
|
|
tank01
|
| posted on 8/7/11 at 04:22 PM |
|
|
starbourd
love the romantic out off focus effect in this shot,,,,,oooowh its love at first sight 
|
|
|
