How have you done your catch tanks? Any fancy baffles inside?
Mine is still causing bother. Ive attached rough sketch. Hope it makes sense.
Original design was simple 1 litre ali tank. 2 inlets at the top (only entering tank by 10mm max). Breather outlet in the top. i was convinced the
vapours were entering such that the oulet was allowing them to escape immediately into the breather. This constantly got full of oil and made a
mess.
I then cut the top off and added a baffle. The theory being the inlet would hit the baffle and at least run to the bottom. I added a drain back to the
block (i know this si an area of discussion but its good oil in the tank). I think i may have the baffle too low and the oil entering is splashing
about and spraying all over making a mess again. Net result - no better off.
Its doing my head in now. i could shorten the baffle and make a vented top for the tank but id rather have less oil getting to the tank.
Oil pressure is great (60 - 70psi hot is normal - average 4.5bar). Engine runs great. I dont suspect any problems with the engine at all (in fact this
si a newer block fitted last winter and the old one was the same). Im using Cortina style crankcase breather. Oil cap is std vented with mesh inside,
piped to the tank.
When i was using the original tank i used to get oil out of the dipstick yube when it was getting full, i dont get this snymore (some weeping from
base of tube but nothing worrying).
As most people know ive researched breathing to death but running out of ideas.
Its a Pinto on bike carbs with Megajolt.
Any ideas? Maybe the design of the catch tank is just wrong and different design is needed. I always thought it would have been better if the 2 inlets
ran lower inside rather than just entering at the top, but i hoped baffle would simulate that.
Im just a tad sick of cleaning the oil up now.
[Edited on 2/10/07 by DarrenW]
[Edited on 8/10/07 by DarrenW]
Here is a pic of the modded tank showing the internal baffle (drain back to tank not shown on this pic).
What im really trying to find out from those with no issues on a Pinto is whats the main difference between your set up and mine. Im sure there will
be a clue there somewhere.
Maybe i need a bottle that is deeper (ie 1.5l pop bottle for a trial) in which i can fit the 2 pipes in directly near the bottom of it and not use the
top which is at least quite high, smallish diameter and tapered.
[Edited on 28/9/07 by DarrenW]
Rescued attachment 19072007138.jpg
There is nothing special about swirl pot design.
The only requirement is that the inlet enters the pot tangentialy, hence the name swirl pot.
Liquid entering then swirls around the side of the pot.
No baffles are required.
Oh, and the inlet should be at the top, exit at the bottom.
Err a swirl pot id different to a catch tank isn't it?
My catch tank is simply a 99p alloy drinks bottle with inlet on the side and filter on the top. After 10k miles there is just a dribble in the bottom
of the tank. I noticed I get some water vapour boiling off sometimes but no oil.
[Edited on 28-9-07 by RazMan]
I made mine from a used small welding gas bottle, dead easy, and no problems yet
What is the configuration of the pipes inside Nib??
http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/photos.php?action=showphoto&photo=catch%20tank.gif
The thing that confuses me the most is how some people have no problems and mine, very similar to the norm from what ive researched, has loads of
bother.
One difference is the rocker cover. Mine is std Ford, no mods (i didnt have to move the filler neck). Dont know if this makes a difference or not.
Troubles in the last week could be attributed to overfilling with oil, but even at a stable level its not great (i have to run between middle and
lower mark, its currently between middle and upper mark on dipstick).
I just need to put my finger on the main big difference and then i should be closer to the solution. Some pics of yours may help if you can oblige
(anyone that is).
Ive also tried bringing the pipe up from crankcase breather at near vertical and teeing into the line from oil filler cap to catch tank - no
difference. i havent yet tried sealing off the filler cap pipe - would this help?
[Edited on 28/9/07 by DarrenW]
Top hose is inlet from breather, the other two visible are connected with clear tube as a sight level indicator, the other tube not visible on the top
goes to a small filter to allow breathing of the air
hope that helps
Thanks Nitram, that was kind of my thinking also but with nothing to confirm it. iwas hoping the baffle would simulate it but i may have the base too
close to the bottom of the tank (ie too close to the top of the residual oil level causing the splatter). It looks OK when car is stationary but of
course the oil will move around on the road.
Do you think something like third sketch titled Idea would be better? Basically a taller bottle, 2 inlets entering at top but going further down,
vented around the neck of the bottle??
[Edited on 28/9/07 by DarrenW]
Is there a reason why you need such a big catch tank?
On most engines you only get a small amount of oil (vapour) coming out of breather pipes and unless it's for racing you can get away with a
breather filter. It's more for tracks that you need a catch tank (to avoid getting oil on the track).
Sounds like there's some pressurisation going on there to force the oil out...
Doesn't sound right to me but I'm a BEC man....
I think that I have sussed your problem.
Both your breather hoses should enter from the top of your tank.
Both relieve crank case pressure.
If the block breather is at the bottom of your tank, it is blowing any oil that collects, out.
You should not let oil from your catch tank to drain back to your sump via your breather anyway.
You should throw it away and top up with fresh.
I have used simple tin cans with the breathers just dropped through the top of the can and tied so that they do not sit on the bottom in the oil.
I think for racing you need at least a 1 ltr tank but some regs might specify bigger.
Here is a simple catch tank that you can adapt to your own:
Description
[Edited on 28/9/2007 by nitram38]
Nitram,
Ive just been talking this through with Mookaloid. Looks like you may have hit the nail on the head.
Both inlets enter at the top. The baffle sort of converts them to bottom feed but problem no. 1 is the baffle is too long.
I understand about draining back to engine, but in my case it is good oil collecting in the tank. I think my 2 main issues are;
1. The drain i have fitted enters the engine via a modded oil gallery plug. This is basically part of the crankcase and subject to the same pressures
that the cortina trap sees. On one hand it does allow oil to drain back but mainly when engine is off. When running, crankcase pressures can also
force the draining oil back up = splatter and mess - ie its acting as a combined breather and drain which in hindsight isnt a good plan.
2. The top of the catch tank is open / too large.
I dont think blocking the drain off will totally solve my problem as for some reason my engine circulates more than average oil (and this is the 2nd
engine to do it). However if it were to drain below oil level in the sump then the crankcase pressures wouldnt try and vacate through it.
Im now planning to shorten the baffle and maybe try some foam / sponge at half way point or try a new bottle as in your pic (this is what i tried to
show in pic 3 of the file but not as good as your sketch). I know Andy D uses a similar bottle to your sketch and gets little oil in it. Im hoping
that a bottle top(eg bike water bottle / small flask), being tapered and smaller entry, will suffice being left open.
My other theory is that my shortened sump design may not be optimal WRT baffles etc. Maybe the oil is being allowed to move around too much and being
closerto the crank could be getting whipped up - this is probs why its sensitive to overfilling.
Thanks for the suggestions - giving me something to think about for the redesign. It has also been suggested that i try clear tube so i can see where
the oil is coming from.
The only downer to the simple bottle idea is that ive tred something similar before a recent track day - using beer can. It still filled and made a mess albeit before i sourced the cortina trap (using sierra trap with valve removed but small bore outlet) and i cant be sure the pipe wasnt too low down.
Have you removed the little box from the side of the block breather?
You should run your hose straight into the block and remove the box.
It contains gauze and a little flap valve.
If the flap valve is left in this causes a build up of pressure.
Unless your catch tank is very low (lower than the block outlet), you should not get more than 0.5mm of oil in the catch tank.
You just need a pipe from your rocker cover cap and one from the block with no drain.
You can even T the pipes together so that only one pipe goes into the catch tank.
Your problem is probably the location of the extra drain, which is forcing oil into your catch tank.
The only oil in there should be only condensed oil from the vapor from both breather hoses.
[Edited on 28/9/2007 by nitram38]
How about sticking a load of aluminium swarf in it, the stuff you buy from sainsburys to clean pots.
The vapour will hit the swarf, form into droplets and drip to the bottom, at present you have a can full of airborne oil fumes.
Regards Mark
Trying 2 seperate tanks for the Crank case and rocker/filler cap is also worth a try even just temporary.
We had the Crank and Rocker breathers coming in at 180 deg from each other and 1 was basically pressurising the other! oil everywhere!
We've had very little in the bottle itself that wasn't watery... but when its not working it comes out just about everywhere! or gets blown
about in the wind and appears to.
Dam Dam Dam 
i have just fitted a return pipe back to the sump and not tryed it yet was that a waste of time then or can i fit a one way valve in
the pipe
Jacko
*coughs* coming from Mr I don't have breathing problems 
The return tapping to the sump must only be on the 205 block cos I can't find it on our 200 block.
I'm sure its been done by somebody on here... hopefully they'll be along to tell you shortly how its done.
Hi Mark [ Mookaloid ] has a return to the sump , a pipe from the oil filler top and a pipe from the side of the block and it works ok as far as i
know
Jacko
What I don't understand is why you would want to return oil to the sump after it has been heated to a vapor?
On your original engine, these oil vapors are fed into the inlet to be burnt.
By returning what is basically knackered oil to your sump, you are destroying/contaminating the good oil that is left in the sump.
[Edited on 28/9/2007 by nitram38]
Probs best not turning the post into a discussion on returning catch tank spoils to a sump, but in my experience what i have found is if the oil isnt
allowed to sit in the tank for some time then it is good oil. It is only when vapours sit their over time that it goes murky and manky. On some
peoples system the caught gunk is little more than waste and i agree - that should be chucked. There seems to be some people that get good oil thrown
into the catch tank in such a volume that you would rather not throw away unless you have shares in Kuwait, whilst others only have horrid stinky
watery vapour type spoils. This is the reason for the thread - mine are good oil
Graham - if you have fitted the drain back to the sump, ie under the oil level in sump, then you will be ok. My problem is partly that iam draining
back via an oil gallery tapping - driving hard this is a breather rather than drain point and i think it is causing splattering.
Nitram,
What do you mean by the block with flap and gauze in??
That ali swarfe looking pan scrubber stuff is a fair idea, i was wondering where i can get some open cell foam from - an old sock filter would be good
if anyone has one kicking about.
[Edited on 28/9/07 by DarrenW]
It's about 20 years since I rebuilt a pinto so I might have got the crossflow breather confused with it,
Whatever valve system is used on the engine, remove it.
The valves were designed to stop oil (liquid) being drawn into the inlet manifold.
You want to have a crankcase that breathes without pressure.
The original oil breather was an emissions device where air was drawn through the block to remove the oil vapour that would normally vent to the
atmosphere and instead burn it off.
On a road car it is fine to have this arrangement, but not on a modified engine or race car.
Catch tanks on race cars are compulsory to help prevent oil spills on the track if you blow a hole in a piston etc.
The fact that your oil has turned to vapour is telling you that it has be heated too much and will have lost some of it's viscosity and
therefore is not much use to your engine.
That is why I said throw it.
A normal road car would have burnt this up and you would have had to top up your oil anyway. So you are not saving anything by returning it to the
sump. All you will be doing is diluting the good oil.
quote:
Originally posted by nitram38
Have you removed the little box from the side of the block breather?
You should run your hose straight into the block and remove the box.
It contains gauze and a little flap valve.
If the flap valve is left in this causes a build up of pressure.
Unless your catch tank is very low (lower than the block outlet), you should not get more than 0.5mm of oil in the catch tank.
You just need a pipe from your rocker cover cap and one from the block with no drain.
You can even T the pipes together so that only one pipe goes into the catch tank.
Your problem is probably the location of the extra drain, which is forcing oil into your catch tank.
The only oil in there should be only condensed oil from the vapor from both breather hoses.
[Edited on 28/9/2007 by nitram38]
quote:
Originally posted by nitram38
Here is a simple catch tank that you can adapt to your own:
Description
[Edited on 28/9/2007 by nitram38]
Just get rid of the drain and try it with the pipe from the filler cap (I am assuming that you have this) and one from the side of the block.
I would even get rid of the Cortina trap as it could be causing a blockage.
I sounds to me that your system is getting pressurized and that is forcing oil into the tank.
As the drain level is in this oil, it is then blowing it out of the tank.
If you do all of this and you are still getting oil thrown out, then do a compression test on your cylinders.
Too much pressure could be your rings are worn and you are getting excessive blow-by.
Pablo, lift the pipes off the bottom of the catch tank and then you shouldn't get any oil out of the dipstick.
If the pipes are touching the bottom, they are not breathing and it is pressurising your crankcase
[Edited on 28/9/2007 by nitram38]
quote:
Originally posted by nitram38
Just get rid of the drain and try it with the pipe from the filler cap (I am assuming that you have this) and one from the side of the block.
I would even get rid of the Cortina trap as it could be causing a blockage.
I sounds to me that your system is getting pressurized and that is forcing oil into the tank.
As the drain level is in this oil, it is then blowing it out of the tank.
If you do all of this and you are still getting oil thrown out, then do a compression test on your cylinders.
Too much pressure could be your rings are worn and you are getting excessive blow-by.
Pablo, lift the pipes off the bottom of the catch tank and then you shouldn't get any oil out of the dipstick.
If the pipes are touching the bottom, they are not breathing and it is pressurising your crankcase
[Edited on 28/9/2007 by nitram38]
Im using 15mm pipe too, darren are you using 10mm? might be worth beefing up the pipes.
Sounds like some good ideas. Im using 1/2" bore rubber hose but the catch tank inlets are maybe only 10.5mm ID. Im now looking for a new temp
bottle where i can bring the pipes in from the top (cable tied to control the depth). From the crankcase i can bring 2 pipes in - one from std
crankcase breather hole and the other from the oil gallery plug that i did try and use as the drain back (unsuccessfully). I may also try and get a
new oil filler cap in case the mexh in mine is a bit crudded up (or at least clean it out).
Thanks for the suggestions.
At one point i have just had the smelly broth of foul liquid in there (early days) but now it is defo good oil being chucked up. Good oil coincides
with changing from restricted Sierra std breather to more open design. Maybe its not open enough.
Ive had same experience with cheapo K&N copy breather filter as well - partly why i removed it and cut top off the tank for a while as an
experiment. I still think most of my problems are currently the drain pipe back pressuring and splattering the oil in the can.
Ok, ive just done a trial and now im well confused!
I found 2 translucent tubes. Both just under 0.5 litres. i havent altered any tubing as i wanted to see what was having the most effect (ie crankcase
or rocker cover). Tube / rubber pipe is 1/2" bore.
Piped one from cortina crankcase breather (that is fitted directly to block), pipe ran vertical and then into the tube about 1/2 way down.
Ran pipe from oil filler cap into second tube, again in about 1/2 way down. This leaves 1/4 litre capacity in each tube. Top of tubes are about level
with bottom of rocker cover (touch higher).
I also left the modified oil gallery plug connected to bottom of existing catch tank as a second brankcase breather.
Done a very short run (1 mile max) but driving hard through revs. Nothing in the oil filler cap tube. Crankcase tube full to bottom of pipe and
splattered all over. Catch tank also has oil in (ie from second crankcase breather).
What on earth is going on???????? As i said before i dont suspect a problem with engine as oil pressure indicated on DD2 display is around 70psi hot
and this is the second engine to do this (i could understand that the first could be worn but second engine has done less than 50K so should be
better). Engine is from E reg injected Granada and was destined for a mint Mk2 Escort, bought from a very reputable person (Mike in Bowburn).
Im fast running out of ideas.
Basically for the trial i havent changed anything other than 3 seperate tanks to see what is happening.
Would removing the cortina trap help or would this give easier path for oil to be thrown out?
Would capping off the second breather (ie gallery plug) help, is it possible air could be getting pulled in and help pressure build up? I tried to use
this as a drain (for recirculation) but find positive pressure causes the returning oil to be splattered about.
Ive just checked the fit of the Cortina trap into the block and its certainly not tight, interestingly there is no oil on the block beneath the
connection at all. i also checked where i pushed the rubber hose into the top grommet and it is just in (ie not to the base of the trap where oil
would gather).
[Edited on 2/10/07 by DarrenW]
for the sake of £7 Id maybe get one of the freeflowing block pipes to replace the cortina trap.
Burton sell them. EDIT part# FP280
Just to confirm the oil is coming out the filler cap tube?
[Edited on 2/10/07 by 2b_pablo]
No, nothing from oil filler cap to report, only from crankcase.
ive just looked at the Burtons part again and from what i can see it is identical to the std sierra PCV but with no valve / plunger inside. I already
tried my modified PVC before and same happened. Does anyone know if the Burtons part is actually different or if my assumption is correct?
Ive looked to see if i can put the breather pipe directly into the block or not - yes o probs can but the angle is not good due to the manifold inlet
and water pipe connection directly above. I havent yet checked to see if the hole in block is straight through or if a tin baffle is fitted
underneath.
[Edited on 2/10/07 by DarrenW]
The burton one is just hollow so no obstrctions at all.
I had bought one but the cortina one I have is working ok so I didnt use it.
Sorry to take a step backwards but you have:
feed from the oil filler cap
feed from the block under the carbs
and another feed too?
Yes, 3 breathers.
Std crankcase position via cortina trap.
Oil gallery plug (oposite side to trap) drilled out and tapped to take a fitting - piped to catch tank (bore on this probs 6mm or so but added to the
1/2" from trap).
Oil filler cap to catch tank.
Currently all 3 feeding into seperate 'tanks' so i can see which feeds the most oil. both crankcase breathers do by a mile. Virtually nowt
from oil filler cap (just vapour, not enough to collect liquid on short run).
All i can think now is the crankcase is pressuring too much or the sump design is allowing oil to be flung all over down below which finds its way out
of the hoses. Oil level is poss a tad too high but only halfway between mid and top mark on dipstick.
can you block up the new breather on the exhaust side to make it work like a conventional system and work from there?
I give my 2.1 pinto a lot of stick on the track and dont get much oil out at all (2-3mm in the tank from the last few months). I run about 4bar oil
pressure too (maybe 5bar when getting lots of stick).
I have an open tank with both pipes "hanging" into it but not to the bottom.
quote:
Originally posted by DarrenW
All i can think now is the crankcase is pressuring too much or the sump design is allowing oil to be flung all over down below which finds its way out of the hoses. Oil level is poss a tad too high but only halfway between mid and top mark on dipstick.
Here are some pics of the sump.
Pic 1 shows the front section plated in to increase forward capacity and the lump cut ready to be modded. You can also see some holes cut to allo oil
to fall into the extended piece.
Rescued attachment P5260350 resize.JPG
The lump then modded to allow pick up hols and dipstick to enter. This was then inverted and welded into the sump as a baffle. You should also see
some Vee's i cut in original part of the sump.
Rescued attachment P5270352 resize.JPG
Then the final modded sump the right way round after the 3mm thick plate was welded to the bottom.
So you can see that rather than cut the entire original base out of the sump ive left it in place and added holes and Vees as the baffle plates.
As far as my research went this is similar to some other modded sumps. I didnt go big wing route as my logic was extending forward added more
capacity. In real terms it takes between 5.5 to 6 litres of oil to between bottom and mid point on dipstick. If i fill over halfway i know it splashes
oil about excessively and it gets burnt off under hard acceleration. Once the level settle no oil is burnt off and the level remains dependant on
catch tank activity.
I can block off the oil gallry hole no problem and just use the 2 breathers pretty much as 2bpablo has shown with no problem so will try and do that
tonight.
I went home at lunch time, did 5 miles at 3K revs max and no oil was ejected. Heavy breathing seems dependant on level of thrash.
[Edited on 2/10/07 by DarrenW]
Rescued attachment P5270357 resize.JPG
quote:
Originally posted by DarrenW
Yes, 3 breathers.
Std crankcase position via cortina trap.
Oil gallery plug (oposite side to trap) drilled out and tapped to take a fitting - piped to catch tank (bore on this probs 6mm or so but added to the 1/2" from trap).
Oil filler cap to catch tank.
Is the oil gallery on a Pinto pressurised? If so this would certainly cause part of my issue so ill block it back off. I originally tapped out the oil
gallery plug to fit the oil temp sender so ill revert back to this for now.
Yep - std PCv valve does work more or less as you say. At low revs vacuum is at max and pulls the plunger open so gasses can be burnt off on std
engine via std carb. Now ive got multi carbs i cant do this. Original PCV was modded to remove springe valve (ie straight through) and later changed
for the cortina oil trap which again is straight through ish. As its not connected back to carbs any more i have this going to catch tank with the
resultant filling issues which could be due to opening the oil gallery (dont think so as catch tank filled before i did this), maybe sump design or
something causing excessive pressure in oil gallery.
When i close off the oil gallery again im back to the original issue of excessive oil being chucked up the crankcase breather pipe. At least i know
its not coming from oil filler cap though now.
I'm not familiar with pinto hence questions.
Oil gallery - what is that then? Is it some smallish hole in the casting that oil dribbles down from the top end into the sump? So if there is
pressure in the engine block, this oil would be under that same pressure surely? As opposed to oil pump pressure which would empy your engine oil!
crank case pressure is due to combustion gases getting past rings? so can't be due to any sump design or modification?
note these are questions rather than statments of fact.
Darren do a photo of your engine the return plug i used was tapped when the block was made by fords to the rear of the exhaust
Is your dip stick the right one for the engine and is the dip stick tube the right length?
Graham
[Edited on 2/10/07 by jacko]
quote:
Originally posted by DarrenW
Yep - std PCv valve does work more or less as you say. At low revs vacuum is at max and pulls the plunger open so gasses can be burnt off on std engine via std carb.
quote:
Originally posted by DarrenW
When i close off the oil gallery again im back to the original issue of excessive oil being chucked up the crankcase breather pipe.
modified sump hmmmmmm - was there some baffle/windage plate whose purpose was to preven oil being flung up into the PCV thing or this oil gallery that you removed?
as far as Im aware the crank breather is normally shut until the vaccum from the carbs pulls the valve open allowing the gases to escape (I guess
there is no real pressure at low revs).
When you fit twin 40s/45s or bike carbs you dont have this feed so the pressure is never realeased and finds another way out. In my case this was out
thru the filler cap or the dipstick or something.
Fitting a cortina trap and a vented cap fixed my problems entirely.
quote:
Originally posted by 2b_pablo
as far as Im aware the crank breather is normally shut until the vaccum from the carbs pulls the valve open allowing the gases to escape (I guess there is no real pressure at low revs).
you sure mate? because before I fitted the cortina trap which doesnt need the vac connection I was getting pressure build up and oil out the filler
cap.
which would imply the breather was shut with no vac attached.
is there not MORE vac with rpm from the inlet manifold as the engine sucks in more air?
Just confused, not saying Im right.
[Edited on 3/10/07 by 2b_pablo]
The std PCV valve is held shut by the spring. At low revs the vacuum is greater, pulls valve open and burns off gasses. As revs increase the air flow
increases and the vacuum is balanced out (this si how it was generally agreed a while ago and im sure the same as Burtons explain it).
Anyway i dont have a PCV anymore so i guess that discussion is academic. Also the first job that anyone who tunes Pintos does is junk the PCV or at
least remove the guts from it to make it straight through.
Im going to take a series of piccies in a mo to better show what i have now.
Keep up the discussions - it is helping.
No comments ref sump?? Ill add dims of dipstick and tube as well soon. Engine is from Granada so dont know if that makes a difference.
can you put a std sump on to test?
quote:
Originally posted by 2b_pablo
you sure mate?
quote:
Originally posted by DarrenW
No comments ref sump?? Ill add dims of dipstick and tube as well soon. Engine is from Granada so dont know if that makes a difference.
Wrong dipstick / tube is very possible as im told the engine is from Granada (the guy i bought engine from bought the full car and removed low milage
engine for his mint Mk2 Escort).
I have attached the following as it has a few more pics ref questions asked recently. Ive also added dipstick and tube dimensions if anyone would be
so kind as to cross reference against their own.
Its lunch time so im off out to disconnect the 'drain' tube and block off the oil gallery again.
In pics i have said what assumptions i have made ref upper and lower oil marks. My level is on the top mark if im right, could be one reason for
issues.
[Edited on 3/10/07 by DarrenW]
stupid question but is your engine at an angle? mine sits vertical.
the exhaust side breather looks pretty low, maybe coupled with the tilt on the engine its getting oil flung up it.
ive just blocked the oil gallery hole back off (refitted oil temo sender). Put a probe down the hole and its straight into the sump so may not actually be defined as an oil gallery point. Also determined i have 100mm oil in the sump.
I think your DIP STICK IS THE WRONG SIZE MY STICK IS 440 TO THE TOP MARK AND 460 TO THE BOTTOM MARK
gRAHAM
Pablo - yes its almost vertical and level.
G - looks like we are onto something here with the stick. Would you believe it?????? I knew it would be something fundamental and simple. Fingers
crossed.
02GF74 sent me an ebay link so ive asked the seller to measure it.
Im also popping up to Andy D's later to measure his up.
If it is this its no wonder i dont get oil surge issues. Interestingly on the old engine if the level dropped to lower mark under hard braking i could
get the oil warning to flash up momentarily on the DD2 display. Never happened since with the 'new' engine. Ill not jump to conclusion until
its tested out but looks like we have a plan.
Ill go measure mine mate (dipstick )
I have just been thinking if the oil is 65-70mm to high and the crank is hitting it is it hard to start the engine . but also how muck power =BHP have
you been losing because of this 15-20 + what do people think
Graham
from the nylon part that sits in the top of the dipstick (ie not including the puller)
to tip: 460mm
to high mark: 430mm
ish
OK, here goes.
3 people have now confirmed same dipstick measurements from top of tube;
To upper level - 437mm
To lower level - 460mm
Total - 466mm.
Assuming people run at mid point this is 448mm
Mine is totally different. 377, 402, 423. Diff between mid points is therefore approx 60mm
Now considering one person has said at approx 440mm they start to get breathing issues then im still 50mm above at least.
Ive no idea what the dipstick is, all i know the pinto one is like a spring, mine is solid. X-flow????
So, next action is to try oil level at 450mm and re-calibrate the dipstick.
Now the interesting bit. I used to get issues with my old block and original dipstick. The guy i gave it to still had it. It measures 420, 445, 450!!!
So is different again to the other 2.
I had to run at between lower and 1/4 mark to avoid significant issues - ie between 445 and 435mm. Compare this to top set of numbers and 440 is known
to have possible issues. So this explains why ive had breather issues on both blocks and why its worse now - well at least in theory anyway. Time to
put research into practice.
Jacko - i hope you are right ref power loss All i know is i want the issue sorted as ive booked the Boggs set up for next Tuesday and looking
forward to a brisk / un-messy drive home
[Edited on 3/10/07 by DarrenW]
Well done Holmes 
drain the oil, change the filter and stick 4.5L into it (or whatever the quoted amount is). make a nick on the dipstick where that goes to.
you could do it with 3.5L first to make a lower mark.
I fill to the top mark btw, not midway.
I presume no joy blocking off the oil gallery breather?
Ive already posted this in other thread but just in case anyone does a search in the future ill add it here as well.
Today i drained oil out (didnt change oil filter as its only done 1000 miles). As a result of unknown origin short dipstick ive ended up with 6.8
litres of oil in the sump!!!! i put 4l back in and ended up with an oil height same as Andy D uses.
Cleaned out catch tank so it was empty and clean. Reconnected pipes (from filler cap and cortina trap - oil gallery is now blocked of as per std
engine). Took it out for same blat as earlier where i had 1/3 to 1/2 litre chucked out. Admiitedly i didnt drive quite as hard but no oil chucked out
this time.
I kept eye on oil pressures. Hot idle 65psi, under acceleration to 75psi ish. Under hard braking dropped to around 30psi but no oil warnings flash up
on digi dash. As those with digi dashes no the readings can scare you sometimes, but if i had std gauge and light i would have been more than happy
that the light didnt come on.
So, a bit early to draw conclusion but looking good so far.
Ill monitor it for a while and if no oil chucked out and level is stable ill mark this as the new mid point on my stick.
Thanks all for your help. Isnt it amazing how the simplest taken for granted things can cause bother? So, happy readers, when you buy 2nd hand donor
bits dont just assume that they are as Ford et al intended
get out and give it a few hoops at 7k - that will tell if its fixed
Well done just one thing Stop messing with the dip stick you have GET the right one and fill the oil to the top mark. your oil capacity will be
right then and the right hight
Graham
Very true Graham except the std dipstick wont fit! Even my slightly shorter one sits 10mm proud of the tube. Bit of a bugger eh??
The very short stick is currently enjoying being kicked around the yard and having abuse hurled at it
quote:
Originally posted by DarrenW
Very true Graham except the std dipstick wont fit! Even my slightly shorter one sits 10mm proud of the tube. Bit of a bugger eh??
The very short stick is currently enjoying being kicked around the yard and having abuse hurled at it
I havent investigated fully yet Graham. Current engine has the same sump and now the same dipstick as previous engine. Ive re-measured the tube and
its closer to 290mm but i dont know what it measured on old engine.
Ill do some measurements later to determine if its reaching bottom of sump or hitting a baffle plate. I wont be too impressed if it does as i was
careful to prevent it when i shortened the sump, im wondering if the curve in the tube is different than before and causing the stick to enter
differently.
quote:
Originally posted by RazMan
Well done Holmes
quote:
Originally posted by 02GF74
that reminds me of the other thing I forgot to say earlier.
If you have too mcuh oil in the sump, the oil is gonna get whacked by the crank so there will be more droplets splashing around in the block.
It should be possible to overfill the engine if you eitehr have wrong dispstick or wrong dispstick tube - is that possible?
You fully justify patting yourself on the back. It was hints and suggestions like that that helped me find out what the main difference between mine
and others was. i would never had suspected that the dipstick was wrong, just didnt enter my mind that there were so many types.
Thanks to all. Fingers crossed for the extended road test to Boggs next Tuesday to get it really singing
got it out a good scalp yet? 
No, not yet. Went to Durham last night and suffering with a monster hangover today Hopefully ill get it out over the weekend for a thrash.
Just done 70 mile in it today. Various revs and loads etc (good spirritted runs when i could - the sort that would have oil spewing out before). Got
back and all that was in the catch tank was 2mm or so of horrid clearish liquid - the stuff you defo wouldnt feed back into the engine. To say im
happy is an understatement.
On the way out it defo felt more pokey. On run back i filled with V-Power - my god!!!!!! What a difference. Gobsmacked.
Cant wait for tomorrow to get the carbs set up now. If Boggs find some more power the conversion has defo been worth it.
My whole aim with this car is to get the same sort of rushes that my old M3 used to give. Ive never quite been there before until today.
excellent mate, thats what Im after too but I cant seem to get the brutalness I think the engine should have given the weight.
quote:
Originally posted by DarrenW
Got back and all that was in the catch tank was 2mm or so of horrid clearish liquid - the stuff you defo wouldnt feed back into the engine.
Darren About time how long have you had this problem ?
good luck with the r/road let us know how you got on
Graham