I dream about building a Locost and am researching madly. What is the general opinion on the relative merits of a Sierra CVH, DOHC, SOHC etc. And what is a Pinto engine?

I am about to retire and have experience of working on vehicles. Part of me likes the sound of spark plugs etc., but I appreciate fuel injection and ECUs etc. what is the consensus on this issue?

I just want to build a car that runs well and does not cause me too many headaches.

Many thanks.

Welcome to the forum!

a Pinto is the "normal" SOHC Sierra engine, came in 1.6 and 2.0 forms, if I remember right. The 2.0 is widely regarded as a good and fairly cheap basis for a Locost and there are lots of tuning possibilities.

Some Sierras had a 1.8 CVH (also used in FWD format in Escorts, etc.). I think this is not so well viewed.

The DOHC was used in the last couple of years of Sierra production. This is not so tunable.

Do a search on here - no doubt someone else will post their opinions.

btw, don't forget that you can use other engines - I've got a Rover K-series in mine, for example, and then there are bike engines to consider.

This is on the Sierra Owners Club

http://forum.fordsierraclub.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=20776

and this from Crustworld:

http://www.crustworld.co.uk/sierra/techspec/index.html

Have fun

SOHC and Pinto are the same thing. Various sizes but 2.0 generally regarded as best to go for. Old hat technology, quite heavy, quite robust, can easily get 120bhp and 0-60 in 6.5 secs. 160bhp is a touch harder but can give under 5.5secs to 60 (and varying scales in between).

By Spark plugs i assume you mean carbs. Nothing wrong with this approach and quite common (this is what i have). Im hoping to upgrade from 38DGAS to quad bike carbs soon.

On pinto you can have std points ignition, std electronic or aftermarket megajolt if you fancy a kind of ECU and 3-D mappable etc.

Cant comment on DOHC other than they are out of favour generally with car builders as perf parts are not so easy to come by. Again cant comment on CVH other than they allow a total donor route and hence quite locost.

A Pinto is a Ford SOHC engine

its old and heavy but simple and strong (comes in old carburated or newer fuel injection flavours)

DOHC engines are a little newer but there is very little that can be done to tune them

Just about all pertol cars on the road have spark plugs
but I think that what you ment was that you might prefer the old distributor (dizzy) and carburator setup - rather than the modern electronic ignition and electronic fuel injection - but that you might be persuaded otherwise

have a look here for info on the ford engines (look in tech support):
https://www.burtonpower.com/default.aspx

also don't nessisarly limit yourself to engines you can find in a sierra - there are lots of other options

The bigger questions are things like:

what are you going to use the car for ? (road or track)

I agree with all of the above particularly;

quote:

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don't nessisarly limit yourself to engines you can find in a sierra

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echo the above.

Don't forget that the vauxhall 2.0 8 valve engine is lighter than a pinto, tougher and costs nothing to buy, and is dead reliable and easy to work on.

Stick a bike engine in it!!

All the best,
Steve / Phil (Team Hellfire)








Seriously though, Sierra engines could get you a cheap car but not necessarily a great car. Pinto is very heavy but does the job admirably.

What do you want the car for?

how about using a zetec - they have better flowing heads,there lighter,higher powered (130bhp standard and with different induction and ecu 170bhp) and there also cheap - about £150 for a complete 2.0 from a mondeo.
pintos are good engines but it is getting harder to find a decent one now adays

One other thing to consider is the age of the engine for the emmisions test

When (/if) you SVA your kit the emissions test should be done based on the age of the engine (as long as you can prove the age) modern engines (post 93 or 95 - I can't remember which) have a tougher test and will need a cat - older than this and you won't need a cat

Pintos won't need a cat - but zetecs will, some of the Vauxhall 8v engines are old enough too and so on

you need to go to a locost meting the next one is 1st monday in feb i think at eye green peterborough, theres a few cars about normally to have a look at.

why not go with a xflow to start with as they are very easy to install for a newbie

quote:

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Originally posted by mcerd1
One other thing to consider is the age of the engine for the emmisions test

When (/if) you SVA your kit the emissions test should be done based on the age of the engine (as long as you can prove the age) modern engines (post 93 or 95 - I can't remember which) have a tougher test and will need a cat - older than this and you won't need a cat

Pintos won't need a cat - but zetecs will, some of the Vauxhall 8v engines are old enough too and so on

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Wow!
What a response and so quick.
A lot to digest here.
Thanks everybody.

stick with a 1600cc crossflow light enough to carry around well almost
loads out there to tune them
145 bhp can be had
pintos are old and heavy cost a fortune to tune and have poor rocker geometry
zetecs ect have fuel injection ect to wire up and worry about

this 1600 crossflow you write of - comes from what car?
how do I get a picture into the post?

I found a great sierra in the local village scrap yard. The man said he could not sell me the whole car, but I could buy the whole car a bit at a time!!!
How can I get around this problem(cheaply)?

Thanks for all the info - I'm learning very quickly.

quote:

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Originally posted by 24vseven
pintos are old and heavy cost a fortune to tune

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I have found a Sierra XR4 with 2.8l engine -will this be suitable-any info on this engine much appreciated. Many thanks.

gahgah,

see here for info on X-Flows (crossflows):
https://www.burtonpower.com/technical/tt_kent.html

for the 2.8 (&2.9) ford V6's see here:
https://www.burtonpower.com/technical/tt_taunus.html

If the 2.8 sierra is a 2wd (ie. XR4 not XR4x4) then it should have everything you'd need but the engine its self may not be the best - they are big and heavy and harder to tune than the Pinto (SOHC) of X-flow

If I were looking for an easy engine to start with (both in tearms off making it go and getting an easy emissions test at the SVA and MOT's) I'd go for an X-flow or a Pinto (like I did ) - then either tune that engine or swap for a more modern one such as the Vauxhall XE, Zetec and so on
see here for zetecs:
https://www.burtonpower.com/technical/tt_zetec.html

or sticking with older engines - swap it for a Cosworth turbo (same block as the Pinto) or a V8 (such as Rover 3.9, Ford 302, Chevy LS1, LS6 or LS7)
Obviously if you were going to put a V8 in you'd need to allow for that from the begining

see here for cossies:
https://www.burtonpower.com/technical/tt_cosworth.html



but thats just me

yes i agree with mikerj pintos are cheep power to a point
and any engine cost a fortune rof decent power i just feel crossflows are a light simple engine
as regareds getting hold of one they were fitted to many fords but the best one is from a mk1 or 2 escort they do turn up on ebay as do the tuning parts or if you need them i do have a couple one complete with 40's hp oil pump steel rocker posts ect not sure of the rest of the spec till i look further on monday but it was removed from a rally car so anythings possible
my view on crossfolws isint biased as i have pintos hanging about to but there easier to find
as for the v6 ford lump what can i say i am useng the same basic engine in mine tho its the cossy version but theres 150-160 bhp there in an 4i lump not to hard to wire up either

[Edited on 20/1/07 by 24vseven]

24vseven and mcerd1, many, many thanks for your comments. You make me feel like a total ignoramus. I am learning as fast as I can. How did you aquire so much knowledge?
In the end I think it will all depend on what car I can find. It seems very difficult to find anything suitable. It is very time consuming and I am impatient to get going.

quote:

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Originally posted by gahgah
It seems very difficult to find anything suitable. It is very time consuming and I am impatient to get going.

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fully agree with mercd your choice has to depend on what you want not what peole tell you you should have

fords are a good start though as most parts can be interchanged

as for the knowledge its just diving in getting on with things and not being afraid to ask if your not sure
you will soon be up to speed
good luck

GahGah,

I started off in a similar position to you, and while I am one of the younger members I have spent much of my years messing around with cars and anything mechanical. I researched my build for around 18months before making a proper start, and I think it has paid off. I decided what I wanted and have pretty much stuck to the original plan.

I went for the pinto engine as I wanted a budget car (I am after all still a student!). I picked up a low mileage 2 litre 205block engine for £30 with a lightened flywheel, and it had been stripped and was still in pieces. I could have simply put it back togther and dropped it in but decided to do some work on it. I fitted all new bearings and rings, carried out some mild porting on the head, fitted a fast road cam and a few other small mods the bolted a pair of 40DCOEs to the side. All in all the engine has cost me around £500 including the carbs and electronic ignition and all the new parts I fitted (probably could have got away without some of them!).

I chose the pinto mainly based on cost, but also on reliability and ease of fitting. There is basically no electronics on the engine, which suits me

Like others have said it really depends what you want as to what engine you fit. If I had a little more cash i would have gone for a duratec installation, and is a possibility for a future upgrade.

There is quite a bit of info relating to my build on my website.

David

PS I notice you are in peterborough. There are a few of us on here around that area, I am in Lynn, and you are welcome to come and have a nosey at my car when I am at home.

[Edited on 21/1/07 by flak monkey]

Flaky Monkey
Saw your web site, very impressed, best of luck with your studies. May well take up your generous offer once I've got myself in a pickle.

Flak Monkey
Sorry got your name wrong. How do you get a sexy pic like yours on the post?
Gahgah

quote:

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Originally posted by gahgah
Flak Monkey
Sorry got your name wrong. How do you get a sexy pic like yours on the post?
Gahgah

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I started off in a similar way (i.e. a student - but I didn't buy anything till I was working ) - its just that I'm not building a locost (sorry) - that should just mean it takes less time to build and will make a bigger hole in my wallet
but I got an XR4x4 donor (for a Dax 4x4 kit) then decided that I really only wanted 2wd - this means I can get the limited slip diff from the 4x4 but it would have been cheaper and easier just to buy the diff

then got a 205 block pinto, although mine was in a 151,000 mile Granada from next door (I got whole car for free - if you know someone's got a suitable old car near you don't be afraid to ask)

I could have just used it as it was, but it really could use a rebuild (its still not done yet)
-then I decided I didn't want to have to mess around with all the EFI wiring (so I got some bike carbs)
-then I saw a good cossie crank going cheep on ebay
-then the cossie con rods
-then I got a steel flywheel
-then the cossie oil pump (for the spray bar)
-now I need a cam, megajolt and some 93mm forged pistons to finish the job - making it a 2.1L, but head mods/porting can wait just now (I might get a NA cossie head later)

I would not recomend doing the same upgrades as I'm doing to the bottom end, this is not a cheep bottom end for a pinto and will not give me any real benafit (other than being able to run it at 8500 - 9000 rpm, once the heads changed that is) most pinto race engines just use std parts !

as you probably tell 'upgrading' can be infectious - you'll want to allow for this when you decide on your engine (just incase you want to upgrade or tune it later on)

[Edited on 22/1/07 by mcerd1]

I started with the intention of fitting the standard 2.0 EFi pinto that came with my donor, it was in perfect condition and even had a full dealer history.....

but then got the upgrade bug...

I had scholar engines rebuild the bottom end to 2.1l with a lightened flywheel dowled to the crank and all balanced - £850 ish

Kent Fr33 cam kit and vernier pulley

uprated oil pump

Megasquirt

GSXR 1000 TBs

and on - and on - and on.......

Once you start it's hard to stop!

Thanks everybody for your input. I have to print it all out and study it.
I know I am to impatient but now I have a donor, Sierra 2l pinto and can't wait to get started on it.
Now it snows and gets very cold

You have started in exactly the right way. Prep the donor bits whilst sussing out the kit route. At least then when kit arrives you can make a good start with clean parts.

Did well to get a pinto Sierra. Injection or carb version?

Injection.
Gone absolutely mad, day and night its on my mind, I can't keep this pace up. I'm taking off for more than I need. I keep thinking this might come in handy.
Garage is a total mess.( so are my hands).
thanks for encouragement.

This injection engine cost £35 bits and materials) with all the ancilliaries, and modified injection system
Rescued attachment Engine Overhead.jpg

Heres a little infomation to tempt you do doing more to it

http://www.pumaracing.co.uk/PINTO.htm

hi, depends on driving style i think, i have both engines sitting in the garage, and im undecided between building a screaming pinto, or the standard dohc, it has loads of torque, good fuel economy, reliable, i had it in a granada, loved it, think it would give good acceleration through the gears in my locost,

Use the pinto, no choice really.

It weighs less than the DOHC, you can tune it for next to nothing (160 bhp is very easily had), you can work on it yourself.

The DOHC is very heavy , there are no tuning parts available and its a very tall engine.

This is mine, engine cost £30, complete with lightened flywheel. I completely rebuilt it and tweaked it slightly Total cost was under £500 including the carbs and tuning parts.

David




[Edited on 18/5/07 by flak monkey]