Have any locost type cars ever been built with a Jaguar V12 engine? They are a LOT heavier than any 4 cil, and even the Rover V8 will seem like a lightweight, but think of the power..

Assuming anormal weight with a 4 cilidner engine of 600kg, and the engine producing around 150hp, that would give 250hp per ton.

But if you'd throw in a V12, producing 300hp in stock form, the weight would climb to 800kg or so, but it would give a power to weight ratio of 375hp per ton..

Ok, so it may not be the most practical engine, and the chassis would have to be stretched a lot, probably at least 6 to 8 inches longer (though likely even more), and it would also have to be wider than normal..

But hey, think about the bragging rights!

An R1 engined locost would have a better power to weight ratio than that and the lighter weight would give better handling.
Sure it would sound impressive and it would have the boast factor but the weight on it's own would have Colin Chapman spinning in his grave.

you could maybe right

but what if you sqeeze out 500Bhp..

should be easy out of an V12 proberly 6litre engine..

an r1=1000cc = 150Hp
if the v12= 6liter = 500Bhp minimum..

offcourse if you reach the same level of volumetric eff..

Tks

Someone built a Luego Viento with a 6cy Jag engine for Racing.Dunno how successful it was. I think there are images on the luego website.

Last time I was down at Luego with my V12, Matt got his tape measure out and declared that it would fit in a Viento.

It would be quick in a straight line but when you got to a corner it would probably just give up and go into the nearest tree

These cars are designed to be light and nippy so i think a big heavy engine like that isn't really in the spirit. Would be interesting to see though.

Pete

EDIT: I've just realised how differenly I think since building my Indy - I now consider an 800kg car to be heavy

[Edited on 16/6/05 by scoobyis2cool]

The chassis would also need strengthening around all the critical areas like diff mountings, suspension etc.

Each to their own but IMHO an engine like that belongs in something like a Cobra replica to make a good grand tourer, not a Seven-esque car which as others have said, are meant to be light and nimble.

I was going to put a ford 5.8 V8 in a locost. I took the sensible option and am keeping it for a cobra or viento.
415 ft/lbs torque and 400 bhp in a locost i thought would be a tad mad, the jad v12 would be even more so!!

The extra work involved wouldnt be worth it in a locost.

you change the hole structure of the car by doing that..

an light fast V8 would be the best thing to do....

but an v12 is more for an Ultima..etc..

imagine what kind of loads the sierra diff needs to transmit..

also think about grip?? what kind of tyres are you gonna fit?

because we all know with out good tyres you can have an million HP..but you don't go forward...

soow the grip levels will be broken..

how lighter an car is..how better his grip with same wheels etc and dimensions..

rubber sticks better with less weight...

altough its only in dry that way....

(becuase in the wet you need pressure to push the water out..)

TKs

Sounds fine untill you start adding the weight of all the other Jag sized bits required --- ever lifted a Jaguar Salsbury rear axle ? I have removed refitted 4 four of them of them even the narrow E Type one is a 4 (strong) man job to move round the workshop. And almost every other part would be twice as heavy as a typical Locost --- 2 exhausts, bigger battery bigger fuel tank. The standard chassis wouldn't be stiff enough espeically if you stretch the wheelbase.

The all up weight would be well over 1000 kg perhaps 1200kg or more.

For the kind cost involved you could build one hell of car with a bike/K series/Zetec/Toyota/Vauxhall engine.

If you want a V12 build a Cobra.

quote:

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Originally posted by tks
you could maybe right

but what if you sqeeze out 500Bhp..

should be easy out of an V12 proberly 6litre engine..

an r1=1000cc = 150Hp
if the v12= 6liter = 500Bhp minimum..

offcourse if you reach the same level of volumetric eff..

Tks

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I say go for it, add a bit more length, add a bit more strength but do choose a better V12 to start with, there must be some BMW or Merc V12's knocking around. If you are feeling flush go for a ferrari!!!, they dont seem to have any probs going round corners.

Has been done by martin Keenen ( MK cars ) sure wiould be good for apissing comp but must be a real brute.....
I do have a photo in a book but not here at present.
Best wishes
Iain

Jag V12 is useable old technology the BMW and Merc units are just too clever thier own good.
BMW design cars with more data networks in the wiring than the average internet provider.
You know the lunatics have taken over the asylum when the head light switch has a microprocessor built in that talks to the engine ecu, the body ecu, the airconditioning controller and the cd player.

[Edited on 17/6/05 by britishtrident]

[Edited on 17/6/05 by britishtrident]

quote:

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Originally posted by britishtrident
BMW design cars with more data networks in the wiring than the average internet provider.
You know the lunatics have taken over the asylum when the head light switch has a microprocessor built in that talks to the engine ecu, the body ecu, the airconditioning controller and the cd player.

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Just thought i'd add that it has been done by robin hood in the past.

http://www.robinhoodengineering.co.uk/
goto cars for sale, then about 3/4 down the page. Is currently for sale.

2 words.....

BOAT Anchor


Rover V8 weighs a couple of Kilo's more than a Pinto Engine. A 4.6 or Bored out to 5.2 will produce a much better car, Lighter and same or more power. and probably handle a darn sight better.

May be that it would be a boat anchor with brutal charm though
best wishes
Iain
Now for a real brutal Locost some one should build one with a Rolls Royce MERLIN engine like the car below
Rescued attachment BeastBig.jpg

another view of the same car
Rescued attachment BeastBack.jpg

and for the last time
Rescued attachment BeastSide.jpg

Wow, that Merlin powered car is really uhh... "special" looking? Nahh, it's just damn ugly, lol.. wonder what gearbox they use... hmm..

That V12 Robin Hood doesn't look all that bad.. I was actually worried about the size of the engine messing up the nice looks of the Seven.. I'll e-mail them to find out if they can tell me a bit more about the weight of the vehicle..

quote:

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Originally posted by akumabito
Wow, that Merlin powered car is really uhh... "special" looking? Nahh, it's just damn ugly, lol.. wonder what gearbox they use... hmm..

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you cant compare an turboed busa with a v12 ok?

sow please....

an v12 will survive 24hrs lemans..
did i say enough?? (and your busa's gearbox/clutch with 350bhp??)

what the hell do you think if you turbo an
petrol V12 with 6litres? and you use an
an big truck turbo? the BMW McClaren V12 6 litres gets 600Bhp with out an turbo! thats the same efficency as an 1 litre 100Bhp bike engine..

i bet you can get 1000bhp or more out of it with minimal pressure.....

(rememeber the renault turbo f1 time )

you just need to think about volumetric effiency... to guess BHP...

and an busa engine is already on its limits..

wy do you guess that an bike lasts for 100.000km (if it already reaches this??) and can be get to the scrap yard..??

an V12 produces much more power to weight as an Turbo ed busa..

the only problem is that you need someting strong to put it in to give it an chance, also due their seize and weight they aren't practical....(weight compared to our chasis)

and don't forget that rpm starts counting when engine displacement is fixed..

Tks

p.s. dont get me wrong.. i like bike engines.. but don't unther estimate an v12...

[Edited on 19/6/05 by tks]

I know of a German guy who builds engines (and cars) as a hobby, and he uses pre-86 engines because he can dump emission controls.
The guy can squeeze about 700hp from a 4-cyl. BMW, and has build a Jaguar V12 he reckons makes about 1400-1500hp!
No way a bike engine will keep up with that. But even apart from top end power: bike engines lack torque, where as a V12 (esp a turbo V12) has loads of it.
Nevertheless, the engine will be pretty heavy, and handling will be compromised to say the least.
I'd only go with one engine type in a locost-type of car: rotary. Non-turbo between 150-180hp, turbo up to 500hp.
And a lot lighter than a V12!
just browse here: http://www.zynki-power.de

Out of all the cars out there, the one that least needs a 6 litre v12 is a 600kg locost. Torque is great of you have the weight that requires it - a locost neither needs nor could handle it IMO.

Mark

ah mark as they say down under "to much is NEVER enough remember tounge is very firmly in cheek with sugestions of a v12 merlin lo cost sure it has been mentioned before but how about this one with a Tank engine (V12) now thi IS a beast now owned by Jay Leno
Best wishes
Iain
Rescued attachment side-view-5-02.jpg

Sorry folks wrong photo thi sis the right one
Rescued attachment sideview.jpg

Jay Leno's car sure ain't no Locost!
Yeah, of course a 6l V12 would be not suitable for a locost. I just wanted to point out it can be VERY powerfull.
Like I said, I believe a rotary engine is ideal: light, powerfull, but userfriendly.
A bike engine is just not that versatile: it needs a lot of RPM's to start moving. It's very good for a track car, but in city traffic it's a whole other story.

lift a jag v12 on an engine crane, with it's gearbox attached, then decide if you want to use it..........................that is if your engine crane is capable of lifting it, will need half a tonne capacity!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Seriously, just the Jag V12 engine and it's auto box weigh the same (in ball park figures) as a whole bike engined 7!!!

i dunno v12 or 550 bhp busa turbo hum choices choices lol