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3.0 v6 duratec tuning or up grading
steveyb - 13/8/13 at 10:09 AM

ive been thinking of replacing my 24v cosworth v6 engine with a more modern engine in my sierra track car.
i have been thinking of a 3.0 duratec v6 but dont know if this would be a good way to go?

what can be done to them to gain more power?
i think it would be best to go with the AJ30 from the s type jag as it comes in rwd layout with a manual getrag 221 box.

what management to run it? megajolt? or better with likes of omex, DTA, emerald?
what cams are good for them?
has any one on here fitted one to a kit car?

is it worth fitting throttle bodies to it as i know its a good upgrade on the 2.0 duratec to ditch the standard inlet manifold
maybe even fit motorbike throttle bodies?

all info and suggestions welcome


mcerd1 - 13/8/13 at 11:26 AM

the 2.5 ford probe V6 on an MX5 box seems to be flavour of the month just now

with ITB's it should be about the same power as your 2.9 but alot lighter
and you can always turbo / supercharge it


steveyb - 13/8/13 at 11:43 AM

I had the car on a rolling road and got 181bhp and 318Nm or 235lb/ft so with the 3.0 duratec I'd get up to the 240bhp but be down on torque.
As for turboing and supercharging I could do that to the 24v.
Maybe I'm better off sticking to the 24v Cosworth an sticking 2 turbos on it, something like 2 td04's or something like that?
But what is a good aftermarket management to run it all? Would mega jolt do it or better to pay the extra for emerald or something?


mcerd1 - 13/8/13 at 12:01 PM

megajolt is spark only - so it's not much use unless your going to run carb's
megasquirt would do it if you like playing with that stuff, if not then your probably looking at omex, emerald, etc....

that applies to pretty much any engine you go for - even your current one



I take it your current engine is a BOA ? (rather than the later BOB)
way back when I was looking at ford V6's someone did once tell me you could get a bit more out of a BOA by fitting the BOB's cam's - not sure what's involved in this swap though as I decided against the ford V6 option


also remember that the quoted figures for the 3.0 duratec will be with its OE injection - I'm fairly sure this is the engine that RazMan used in his car with his own custom ITB setup - so I think he'd be the best one to ask about tuning it:
http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/members/RazMan/


big_wasa - 13/8/13 at 12:33 PM

I was going to have a play with a jag lump because as you say it's a rwd 240 bhp v6 out of the box.

I was going to have a go at the standard ecu as it's more or less free.


steveyb - 13/8/13 at 04:09 PM

quote:
Originally posted by mcerd1
megajolt is spark only - so it's not much use unless your going to run carb's
megasquirt would do it if you like playing with that stuff, if not then your probably looking at omex, emerald, etc....

that applies to pretty much any engine you go for - even your current one



I take it your current engine is a BOA ? (rather than the later BOB)
way back when I was looking at ford V6's someone did once tell me you could get a bit more out of a BOA by fitting the BOB's cam's - not sure what's involved in this swap though as I decided against the ford V6 option


also remember that the quoted figures for the 3.0 duratec will be with its OE injection - I'm fairly sure this is the engine that RazMan used in his car with his own custom ITB setup - so I think he'd be the best one to ask about tuning it:
http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/members/RazMan/


No, not going carbs, I would rather not go mega squirt as there's not many tuners around me will work with it.
I was looking at the emerald k6 ecu... Need to get saving, where would be the cheapest place to buy this ecu?
Yes current engine is BOA, and yes if you change cams to later it can make a little difference, I can't remember if its all 4 or just 2 inlet?

How do the v6 duratecs take to turboing on standard internals on say 8-10 psi of boost.
Looking into it I might be better sticking with the Cosworth an putting a single turbo with a link pipe from the other bank.


PhillipM - 13/8/13 at 06:13 PM

They do free up a lot on throttle bodies, and yes, the stock cams are rather mild, decent cams/headwork and bodies with the appropriate manifold should see you around the 300 level, with a nice broad torque curve.

If you want more than that you need pistons and rods really so you can use more revs.


steveyb - 13/8/13 at 10:20 PM

quote:
Originally posted by PhillipM
They do free up a lot on throttle bodies, and yes, the stock cams are rather mild, decent cams/headwork and bodies with the appropriate manifold should see you around the 300 level, with a nice broad torque curve.

If you want more than that you need pistons and rods really so you can use more revs.


Who does cams for the v6 duratec? Or is it more so the American market?
And again is it the same for pistons and rods?


PhillipM - 13/8/13 at 10:29 PM

Well, they're definately available for the AJ (yes, mainly US made, but most of them sell on ebay) these days, from both Pautner and Wossner so I assume they would fit the normal duratec too. I think Arrow do them too but not sure one the price.
Catcams and Piper do cams for them, and solid lifter conversions.

[Edited on 13/8/13 by PhillipM]


steveyb - 14/8/13 at 01:44 PM

got some good news, i was talking to the tuner and he said he will work with mega squirt.
so what is my best option for mega squirt ecu?
buy a pro / plug and play if available?
buy components and build my own?
again the ecu will need to be for a v6 engine either cosworth or duratec


steveyb - 14/8/13 at 01:57 PM

had a look there and came across this
http://trigger-wheels.com/store/contents/en-uk/d31.html
but what options would i need to be taking with it?
built in lamba?
wide band etc?
this is all new to me but i'm willing to learn it all


alfablack - 14/8/13 at 07:10 PM

Hi I have an aj3.0 v6 to go into a sylva stylus
240hp + and 215ft lbs
that is with 4 cats on as well. remove them and you are going to increase hp straight away

the jag and mazda are the same as in variable cam timing and solid lifters. the ford and Lincoln use the same
if you are going to use it in anything else you are better of using the mondeo st220 sump and pick up.
cams and verniers are available at piper so you can junk the variable cam timing if you want.

on throttle bodies with stock pistons and on programmable ecu I know of a ginetta g21 doing 300hp and on the data logger it as shown 9000rpm on down shift this has done 2 years in this form.

the canems is a good ecu with the provision for switchable maps,

pistons are available from summit racing in the states for oval and street racing and are quoted at 146 dollars for the set postage would probably be twice that though


PhillipM - 14/8/13 at 07:31 PM

If you're going to take it to 9krpm and go silly with it 360bhp is doable for an engine with a check over once every 12 months.


alfablack - 14/8/13 at 08:06 PM

they did not take it to 9 grand it showed that on the data logger on down shifting on some occasions this is a standardish engine doing 300hp. and this car is being raced and as not been touched for 2 years. so for road use very reliable power.
the comparison to the boa or bob engine is half the weight and better performance for less money spent modern designed the base is already there you just need to exploit it


alfablack - 14/8/13 at 08:11 PM

Oh and it as a 89mm bore so no you cant use the 2.0 or 2.3 duratec parts. they used the crank from the mondeo 2.5
to keep the stroke down you can mix and match and end up with a 3.5 which is what they call the cyclone engine that ginetta use in the g50 in gt class


steveyb - 14/8/13 at 10:57 PM

quote:
Originally posted by alfablack
Hi I have an aj3.0 v6 to go into a sylva stylus
240hp + and 215ft lbs
that is with 4 cats on as well. remove them and you are going to increase hp straight away

the jag and mazda are the same as in variable cam timing and solid lifters. the ford and Lincoln use the same
if you are going to use it in anything else you are better of using the mondeo st220 sump and pick up.
cams and verniers are available at piper so you can junk the variable cam timing if you want.

on throttle bodies with stock pistons and on programmable ecu I know of a ginetta g21 doing 300hp and on the data logger it as shown 9000rpm on down shift this has done 2 years in this form.

the canems is a good ecu with the provision for switchable maps,

pistons are available from summit racing in the states for oval and street racing and are quoted at 146 dollars for the set postage would probably be twice that though

What throttle bodies were used on that engine at 300bhp and what cams were being used? Or where they standard cams?
That would probably still not be bad price for pistons.
If I knew what all I needed I could probably get shipped to my aunts house in New York as I plan to go out in a few weeks time to visit.


steveyb - 14/8/13 at 10:59 PM

And do yo happen to know what the torque output was for it?

[Edited on 14/8/13 by steveyb]


steveyb - 14/8/13 at 11:19 PM

quote:
Originally posted by alfablack
they did not take it to 9 grand it showed that on the data logger on down shifting on some occasions this is a standardish engine doing 300hp. and this car is being raced and as not been touched for 2 years. so for road use very reliable power.
the comparison to the boa or bob engine is half the weight and better performance for less money spent modern designed the base is already there you just need to exploit it


It won't be in an everyday car so, only used for track /drift days


PhillipM - 14/8/13 at 11:49 PM

quote:
Originally posted by steveyb
And do yo happen to know what the torque output was for it?



The race one I know of is about 265lb/ft, ~360bhp, build for endurance use, so probably a nice build for a track toy too if you have the cash for it.


steveyb - 15/8/13 at 10:13 AM

found a place selling the canems ecu
http://www.lloydspecialistdevelopments.co.uk/canems-6-cylinder-fully-programmable-ecu

ive never heard of this ecu so at that money i think i would pay the extra and go emerald k6
or is this a better ecu than the emerald?


alfablack - 16/8/13 at 08:47 AM

Hi throttle bodies they used titan purely because of clearance under bonnet but jenvey do a full kit ready to bolt on
to start they where on standard cams but fitted verniers to remove the variable cam.
it is a very good ecu it as switchable maps so you can flick between road and a race setup.and straight forward to setup with lots of help from them.
an ecu is an ecu they all supply the same thing inputs and outputs it just depends how easy they are to use
megasquirt does the same thing you would be paying 2grand for a motec system to do with the exception of some data logging and maybe a few extras.
Dave at emerald is very good and knows is stuff and can help with your setup he can supply and fit plus programme and he wont have your pants down


andygtt - 17/8/13 at 10:41 AM

My duratec 3.0l is running 700bhp and 590ftlb in a mid engine application so they are extremely tuneable.

If you prepared to go turbocharged you can boost a standard st220 engine to 390bhp with only changing the con rods (I know lots of second hand arrow ones for sale) and some cheap spray jets to cool pistons (new cams not needed or flowed heads).... I'm running a motec in mine but most people run an mbe unit that can be got for under £500.

I've bought a jag version to look at using the head which is superior, but only real gain would be high end rpm and I already rev to 8000rpm

Have you guessed what car uses a turbocharged version of this engine as standard?

Btw the 2.5l version isn't anything like as tenable as the 3l


steveyb - 19/8/13 at 10:01 PM

quote:
Originally posted by andygtt
My duratec 3.0l is running 700bhp and 590ftlb in a mid engine application so they are extremely tuneable.

If you prepared to go turbocharged you can boost a standard st220 engine to 390bhp with only changing the con rods (I know lots of second hand arrow ones for sale) and some cheap spray jets to cool pistons (new cams not needed or flowed heads).... I'm running a motec in mine but most people run an mbe unit that can be got for under £500.

I've bought a jag version to look at using the head which is superior, but only real gain would be high end rpm and I already rev to 8000rpm

Have you guessed what car uses a turbocharged version of this engine as standard?

Btw the 2.5l version isn't anything like as tenable as the 3l


700bhp you say, do tell me more :-)
I'd be happy enough with around the 400bhp mark for now.
I've been thinking more on the aj30 jag engine rather than the st220 engine, but is there any difference in the conrods in two engines?
What's the story on the arrow rods? And I'd prob be interested in some of these and the spray jets if you could let me know please.
I've been looking at the vipec v44 ecu as it can control of up to four variable cams and support for engines up to twelve cylinders, and has anti lag which could be useful.

[Edited on 19/8/13 by steveyb]


andygtt - 20/8/13 at 09:48 AM

The jag bottom end is essentially the same as the mondeo one (so ford st220 box just bolts up), the stock ford pistons have been taken to 500bhp...spec for a 500bhp st220 engine is shorter arrow con rods, spray jets and turbo / turbos to suit.... Everything else, cams, crank, pistons, heads etc are all completely stock st220... Of cause you need manifolds, fueling, ecu etc etc which also costs but you need that on any engine of same power.

To make a reliable well proven 400bhp, you will only need the spray jets and con rods... This is the changes noble made to the engine from the ford factory units to make 352bhp, remap and mod to fuel pump sees 400bhp in them all the time... May sound like a bodge but there are literally hundreds of cars out there running this spec and it works.

Also the looms are well proven and easy to copy, 2nd hand mbe ecu's with maps are available and clutch packages are available.... If you lack room you could simply fit a single turbo as I have done, any suggestions that it would be laggy are wrong, mine is actually significantly less leggy than the twin turbo setup I took off and yet it makes more power than the twins could get close to doing. It's all about spacing it correctly and getting the entire package working together.

I removed the twin turbos off of mine and went for a single turbo option but the engine is heavily modified with different con rods again, forged pistons, reground cams, flowed heads etc etc etc.

I bought a jag engine and stripped it to compare with my ford v6, I have a motec m800 running my car so can do the variable valve timing, but just couldn't see the gain to justify to extra complexity and development. Mine revs to 8000rpm already and is actually capped at 700bhp because I can't find a road box to take the torque... I've no doubt the engine would make 750-800bhp if I pushed it, was tempted while on dyno but decided to be sensible lol



[Edited on 20/8/13 by andygtt]


steveyb - 20/8/13 at 12:40 PM

quote:
Originally posted by andygtt
The jag bottom end is essentially the same as the mondeo one (so ford st220 box just bolts up), the stock ford pistons have been taken to 500bhp...spec for a 500bhp st220 engine is shorter arrow con rods, spray jets and turbo / turbos to suit.... Everything else, cams, crank, pistons, heads etc are all completely stock st220... Of cause you need manifolds, fueling, ecu etc etc which also costs but you need that on any engine of same power.

To make a reliable well proven 400bhp, you will only need the spray jets and con rods... This is the changes noble made to the engine from the ford factory units to make 352bhp, remap and mod to fuel pump sees 400bhp in them all the time... May sound like a bodge but there are literally hundreds of cars out there running this spec and it works.

Also the looms are well proven and easy to copy, 2nd hand mbe ecu's with maps are available and clutch packages are available.... If you lack room you could simply fit a single turbo as I have done, any suggestions that it would be laggy are wrong, mine is actually significantly less leggy than the twin turbo setup I took off and yet it makes more power than the twins could get close to doing. It's all about spacing it correctly and getting the entire package working together.

I removed the twin turbos off of mine and went for a single turbo option but the engine is heavily modified with different con rods again, forged pistons, reground cams, flowed heads etc etc etc.

I bought a jag engine and stripped it to compare with my ford v6, I have a motec m800 running my car so can do the variable valve timing, but just couldn't see the gain to justify to extra complexity and development. Mine revs to 8000rpm already and is actually capped at 700bhp because I can't find a road box to take the torque... I've no doubt the engine would make 750-800bhp if I pushed it, was tempted while on dyno but decided to be sensible lol


[Edited on 20/8/13 by andygtt]


It’s the single turbo route I want to go with it, and I like to hear that you have less lag with it.
The manifolds I can make up myself so just need to look up the best way of routing the pipework as you say about getting the spacing correct.

I looked more into the s type jag’s and I have found one but it’s a 1999 model? I thought the s types where only from 2000 – 2009. So I looked into this and found out

The first-generation 3.0L Duratec blocks produced from 1996 through 1998 can be identified by the “F5DE” casting number on the engine block. In 1999, Ford changed to a slightly different casting (XW4E) which has different coolant passages on the right side that require a different head gasket. Install an old style head gasket on this engine and it will leak coolant. The following year, Ford revised the block casting slightly and reduced the size of the knock sensor threads from 12 mm to 8 mm. Other than that, the 1999 and newer blocks are interchangeable. The 2000-’04 blocks use casting number XW4E-BA.”
Flat-top pistons with a slight dome are used without valve reliefs in the older 3.0L Duratec engines that do not have variable valve timing, but pistons with four valve reliefs are required for additional valve clearance in the newer versions with VVT.
I don’t know if this applies to the AJ30 jag engine or if all the s type jags in cluding the 99 model use variable valve timing? And if the 99 model is still 240 hp (179 kW; 243 PS) and 216 lb•ft (293 N•m) as the 200-2009 ones are? I’m getting a lot of mixed info on it.

As for your gearbox, I’m not sure what your engine – gearbox setup is with it being mid engine but the skyline gearbox is a strong up grade some people use on cars. This prob wouldn’t suit as your gearbox may be more like the audi or Passat style setup with the gearbox? Have you a link to any of your build?


CNHSS1 - 20/8/13 at 01:56 PM

im guessing youre a Nobber then Andy?

impressive figures for so little hardware changed on the engines, very cool

EDIT

oops, spotted youd mentioned the car before--should've read the post

[Edited on 20/8/13 by CNHSS1]


andygtt - 20/8/13 at 04:13 PM

I'm not an expert on the jag ones, they are vvt and I know where you can get brand new complete engine for 1200 plus vat if that's a route you want.... But regarding cams, mapping etc you would be on your own as we all use the st220 engine and it makes silly power and revs to death so little point upgrading to the jag.
We also run ecu variable boost which the mbe also has, so your power curve is easily tailored to your application.

As my engine is traverse the skyline gearbox won't fit, I use a modified st220 one that I bought for 250 from eBay and had a quite and oil cooling added along with few other minor mods.


alfablack - 20/8/13 at 05:48 PM

Does anyone know what weight the jag ajv6 engine is


oli192 - 17/9/13 at 03:30 PM

I have an AJ30 in in my Stylus and I love it!


Sorry I do not know what it weighs but the answer is not a lot. I was really impressed at how light it was also the Getrag box is pretty light as well.

I am really interested in this method of increasing the capacity to 3.5 using 2.5 parts, can anyone confirm which bits are necessary. 2.5 crankshaft but which con rods?

[Edited on 17/9/13 by oli192]


alfablack - 17/9/13 at 03:45 PM

not sure I thought the jaguar used the mondeo 2.5 crank if the 3.0 one is different then that where it comes from. I would think andygt could possibly have the answer.

OLI192 what gearbox have you used in the sylva


mark chandler - 17/9/13 at 05:41 PM

I have a new emerald K5 and MAP sensor that I may sell, purchased last year for a project that never happened.

If you are interested u2u me.

Regards Mark


oli192 - 17/9/13 at 06:27 PM

I used the S-type gearbox. It is shorter than the Type-9 that came out but it is a little wider so it is VERY tight against the frame now.

With only 7 bhp more than standard and almost 900kg less to resist it the gearbox is not straining. The real compromise is that I am still using the Jag dual mass flywheel until I can find an alternative solution.

I am using a K6 Emerald so that is an option that does work.


Bent Wrench - 14/1/14 at 02:37 AM

Aluminum flywheels are on Ebay all the time

Fidanza # 186251

Same flywheel used on the Noble

I will be using a MegaSquirt MS2 on mine.

[Edited on 14/1/14 by Bent Wrench]


magpies - 19/8/18 at 05:29 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Bent Wrench
Aluminum flywheels are on Ebay all the time

Fidanza # 186251

Same flywheel used on the Noble

I will be using a MegaSquirt MS2 on mine.

[Edited on 14/1/14 by Bent Wrench]


Hi - thread resurrection

What clutch do you use with the Fidanza? and Getrag 221 (S Type manual 5 speed)

I'm looking at ecu options on this standard engine with only inlet KnN and exhaust - no cats mods.

What Throttle body are you using with cable (Modeo ST220?) or I can convert mine to fly by wire as I have a complete Jag car at the mo


big_wasa - 19/8/18 at 05:53 PM

I don’t know of any of the shelf jag s type single mass flywheels. Those that fit the the x type or Mondeo have a differant ring gear patern to the s type.

The only of the shelf combo is the s type dual masses setup.

There is a guy that has machined a single mass Mondeo flywheel to take the jag ring gear.

Mine is a little more complicated as it’s an rx8 gearbox so I can’t even use the jag flywheel as the clutch won’t work. Leaving me with the above as an only option, or .... I could make a bracket for the Mondeo starter but it mounts to the gearbox and also needs to go into the transmission tunnel.

I’ve worked back the St220 ecu so that should run it nicely for the princely sum of £25. But it won’t switch the Jags vvt.



[Edited on 19/8/18 by big_wasa]


alfablack - 19/8/18 at 10:52 PM

TTV do a lightened flywheel for a 71/4 clutch for the jag
They may even do a standard bolt pattern or they will do whatever you wish.
Ecu canems is a great option


big_wasa - 20/8/18 at 05:17 AM

Thanks for that.
Last time I looked it was only the x type / Mondeo and I bought one of them as I was going to mid mount it.
I bet that's a £1200 package and it still won't work with the rx8 box with out a new plate.

I must stop buying ttv flywheels for projects and not using them.


alfablack - 20/8/18 at 06:45 AM

Glad to hear I am not the only one
Flywheel was around £250
I destroyed an automatic gearbox chopped the bellhousing of machined it down and and welded two ends of a bellhousing together so I could fit a T5 tvr tuscan box


RWD Focus - 21/8/18 at 05:49 AM

Hi Big Wasa, so you have the pin outs etc to get the st220 ecu running in a kit car for example?
Thanks


Schrodinger - 21/8/18 at 07:20 AM

Look in Fuel injection EFI

https://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/forum/47/viewthread.php?tid=190440

[Edited on 21/8/18 by Schrodinger]


big_wasa - 21/8/18 at 07:56 AM

quote:
Originally posted by RWD Focus
Hi Big Wasa, so you have the pin outs etc to get the st220 ecu running in a kit car for example?
Thanks


Yep, just need to do some testing before I post them up.

http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/viewthread.php?tid=212606

[Edited on 21/8/18 by big_wasa]


magpies - 13/3/19 at 07:39 PM

Hi
can you show / tell mewhat youhave done regarding the oil filter. I'm looking to fit a remote filter and oilcooler but they seem to need either 3/4bsp or M20 blockconnection but the Jag is M22.


Oddified - 13/3/19 at 08:41 PM

I machined up an adaptor sleeve/tube, half is threaded M22 for in the engine and the other half is 3/4 unf (common thread for Mocal take offs and filters), the take off plate just screws on as normal then. I can post a picture tomorrow if needed, but it's fairly simple really.

Ian


CosKev3 - 14/3/19 at 09:18 AM

quote:
Originally posted by magpies
Hi
can you show / tell mewhat youhave done regarding the oil filter. I'm looking to fit a remote filter and oilcooler but they seem to need either 3/4bsp or M20 blockconnection but the Jag is M22.


I've cut the original S type filter extension/housing down and welded AN10 fittings onto the housing where the exposed holes exit


40inches - 14/3/19 at 10:47 AM

quote:
Originally posted by CosKev3
quote:
Originally posted by magpies
Hi
can you show / tell mewhat youhave done regarding the oil filter. I'm looking to fit a remote filter and oilcooler but they seem to need either 3/4bsp or M20 blockconnection but the Jag is M22.


I've cut the original S type filter extension/housing down and welded AN10 fittings onto the housing where the exposed holes exit


My welding skills aren't up to that. I tapped the hole and used fittings
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big_wasa - 14/3/19 at 11:32 AM

I've been wondering how the aj30 differs to the Duratec 30 ?
It's got a big filter on a big and rusty modine oil warmer.

So the thread is M22 ?

Unlike the st170 / Rs the sleeve is one piece not two so I can't just bin the modine and leave the filter even if there was room for engine mounts which I doubt. I can't just add two hydraulic fittings either as the block is machined for a filter and the casting is very thin.

Something else to ponder


andygtt - 14/3/19 at 11:44 AM

Duratec 30 has a water to oil cooler with a filter that's inline with the block exit (so would be were the AJ30 engine mount is).

Im running a dry sump system on my AJ30.


40inches - 14/3/19 at 02:12 PM

quote:
Originally posted by andygtt
Duratec 30 has a water to oil cooler with a filter that's inline with the block exit (so would be were the AJ30 engine mount is).

Im running a dry sump system on my AJ30.


Yep! The AJ30 uses the Duratec filter fixing to fit the engine mount


magpies - 14/3/19 at 11:48 PM

Hopefully I have just purchased the correct item........ I'll let you know when I fit it

Mocal TOP1G M22 Remote Oil Filter Take Off Plate - Dual 1/2 BSP Fittings


andygtt - 15/3/19 at 09:59 AM

Shame, I have a duratec 30 take off plate going spare now lol


B33fy - 15/3/19 at 04:30 PM

Jag 3.0 engine getrag box, prop and ancillaries for sale. £800 if anyone is interested. St220 baffled sump fitted.


magpies - 13/4/19 at 08:09 PM

Making our own manifold and system. I have done the silencer 3"bore and twin 2"pipes to the back and Mike the garage owner is making the manifolds to the silencer

Can't see how to upload photos from the phone


big_wasa - 13/4/19 at 08:28 PM

The photo upload on here hasn’t worked for a while. It’s a case of uploading them to a third party. Imgur works fairly well but you have to reduce the size down first.

I’ve got a pair of very long primary 3 to 1 manifolds. I think the secondaries are 2.5”

If I get the wiring looms finished I will stick them on and grab a photo next weekend.


magpies - 13/4/19 at 10:39 PM

Hi big-wasa
Checked out on reputable site for bhp vs exhaust size and opinion seems to be primaries 50bhp - 31mm dia. But 38 is the smallest available. Collectors 150bhp - 2" and up to 300bhp - 2.75" but can't get silencer at that so had to go 3". I'm hoping for close to 270/280 with no cats and not much silencing.


magpies - 13/4/19 at 10:41 PM

Build thread on piston heads TVR S Series pae. Cosy sold and Jag bought.......


big_wasa - 14/4/19 at 12:19 PM

I will have a look.


40inches - 14/4/19 at 12:54 PM

quote:
Originally posted by magpies
Hi big-wasa
Checked out on reputable site for bhp vs exhaust size and opinion seems to be primaries 50bhp - 31mm dia. But 38 is the smallest available. Collectors 150bhp - 2" and up to 300bhp - 2.75" but can't get silencer at that so had to go 3". I'm hoping for close to 270/280 with no cats and not much silencing.


I fitted ST200 inlet and exhaust headers with 2" pipe front to back. That got me 272 bhp with 200 torques at 1800rpm
going up to 250 at 4000-5000rpm.
The power was still increasing at 7200rpm, we are going to do another power run at the end of the year with the rev limiter
increased to 7600rpm, just to see


magpies - 14/4/19 at 01:43 PM

Plan A is to use an Alpha v6 32v inlet plenum if it will fit.
Plan B is to look at the ST range


big_wasa - 14/4/19 at 06:47 PM

Does the st200 inlet mani have dual length runners controlled by an Inlet manifold runner control modual like the base model ?


CosKev3 - 14/4/19 at 08:52 PM

quote:
Originally posted by big_wasa
Does the st200 inlet mani have dual length runners controlled by an Inlet manifold runner control modual like the base model ?


Dual length runners yeah,and some sort of secondary butterflies in the lower inlet manifold.

The ST220 runs some flaps in the upper inlet manifold same as the jag.


40inches - 14/4/19 at 10:05 PM

quote:
Originally posted by big_wasa
Does the st200 inlet mani have dual length runners controlled by an Inlet manifold runner control modual like the base model ?

As Kev says, yes. I cut them off and used the bottom half to make the spacer.
Valves on the left side of photo
Description
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Oddified - 15/4/19 at 07:59 PM

quote:
Originally posted by CosKev3
quote:
Originally posted by big_wasa
Does the st200 inlet mani have dual length runners controlled by an Inlet manifold runner control modual like the base model ?


Dual length runners yeah,and some sort of secondary butterflies in the lower inlet manifold.

The ST220 runs some flaps in the upper inlet manifold same as the jag.


I don't think the ST220 has any flaps/dual length runners in the intake system where as the ST200 does though.

Ian


RWD Focus - 20/4/19 at 11:40 AM

What spigot bearing are people using in the AJ30 engine when mated to a Mazda RX8 gearbox? Any sizes or part numbers please?


CosKev3 - 20/4/19 at 12:07 PM

quote:
Originally posted by RWD Focus
What spigot bearing are people using in the AJ30 engine when mated to a Mazda RX8 gearbox? Any sizes or part numbers please?


6202RS

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F273157874323


RWD Focus - 20/4/19 at 12:09 PM

Brilliant, thank you.


big_wasa - 20/4/19 at 12:11 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Oddified
quote:
Originally posted by CosKev3
quote:
Originally posted by big_wasa
Does the st200 inlet mani have dual length runners controlled by an Inlet manifold runner control modual like the base model ?


Dual length runners yeah,and some sort of secondary butterflies in the lower inlet manifold.

The ST220 runs some flaps in the upper inlet manifold same as the jag.


I don't think the ST220 has any flaps/dual length runners in the intake system where as the ST200 does though.

Ian


No the st220 doesn’t and I know the plain 24v does as it’s a cheap source of Imrc’s for St170’s
I was just curious of why go to all the effort modifying the St200.


big_wasa - 20/4/19 at 12:15 PM

quote:
Originally posted by CosKev3
quote:
Originally posted by RWD Focus
What spigot bearing are people using in the AJ30 engine when mated to a Mazda RX8 gearbox? Any sizes or part numbers please?


6202RS

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F273157874323




Learn something new every day. I was going to turn up a holder for the Zetec spigot bearing.


CosKev3 - 20/4/19 at 01:38 PM

quote:
Originally posted by big_wasa
quote:
Originally posted by Oddified
quote:
Originally posted by CosKev3
quote:
Originally posted by big_wasa
Does the st200 inlet mani have dual length runners controlled by an Inlet manifold runner control modual like the base model ?


Dual length runners yeah,and some sort of secondary butterflies in the lower inlet manifold.

The ST220 runs some flaps in the upper inlet manifold same as the jag.


I don't think the ST220 has any flaps/dual length runners in the intake system where as the ST200 does though.

Ian


No the st220 doesn’t and I know the plain 24v does as it’s a cheap source of Imrc’s for St170’s
I was just curious of why go to all the effort modifying the St200.


ST200 one looks much better,and is the tightest to engine so you can mount engine higher.
Think ST220 would cause issues with bonnet,unless you sat engine on a angle.
ST220 lower inlet manifold does not fit onto a AJ30's heads,the injectors are in a different angle,and the ports are different size.
Not sure if a ST220 upper will bolt straight onto a AJ30 lower inlet manifold


40inches - 20/4/19 at 02:46 PM

quote:
Originally posted by CosKev3
quote:
Originally posted by big_wasa
quote:
Originally posted by Oddified
quote:
Originally posted by CosKev3
quote:
Originally posted by big_wasa
Does the st200 inlet mani have dual length runners controlled by an Inlet manifold runner control modual like the base model ?


Dual length runners yeah,and some sort of secondary butterflies in the lower inlet manifold.

The ST220 runs some flaps in the upper inlet manifold same as the jag.


I don't think the ST220 has any flaps/dual length runners in the intake system where as the ST200 does though.

Ian


No the st220 doesn’t and I know the plain 24v does as it’s a cheap source of Imrc’s for St170’s
I was just curious of why go to all the effort modifying the St200.


ST200 one looks much better,and is the tightest to engine so you can mount engine higher.
Think ST220 would cause issues with bonnet,unless you sat engine on a angle.
ST220 lower inlet manifold does not fit onto a AJ30's heads,the injectors are in a different angle,and the ports are different size.
Not sure if a ST220 upper will bolt straight onto a AJ30 lower inlet manifold


That about sums it up. The Jag upper is huge, it has two variable, large, stepper motor valves .
The ST220 fits straight on the Jag lower, but is still big and causes bonnet fit issues.
The ST200 looks better, and probably flows better, if my dyno results are anything to go by.
It is a faff to fit, but is worth it.


big_wasa - 20/4/19 at 04:02 PM

That will be why the jag jenveys arnt a bolt on fit then

Any one looked into the cyclone engine parts


RWD Focus - 21/4/19 at 08:49 AM

Is there a direct fit bolt on throttle body non fly by wire that will fit standard AJ30 inlet. I need one that is cable operated. ST220 one is different bolt pattern.
Thank you


40inches - 21/4/19 at 09:33 AM

quote:
Originally posted by RWD Focus
Is there a direct fit bolt on throttle body non fly by wire that will fit standard AJ30 inlet. I need one that is cable operated. ST220 one is different bolt pattern.
Thank you

Can't you make an adaptor plate? Or fit the ST220 upper, it's a lot smaller than the AJ30 and doesn't have all the stepper motor crap.


CosKev3 - 21/4/19 at 09:50 AM

quote:
Originally posted by RWD Focus
Is there a direct fit bolt on throttle body non fly by wire that will fit standard AJ30 inlet. I need one that is cable operated. ST220 one is different bolt pattern.
Thank you


As above,or weld on some pieces of alloy to inlet to allow you to mount the ST220 TB


RWD Focus - 21/4/19 at 09:51 AM

Had a quick look yesterday and st220 upper seems to foul on filler etc if you to mount it with throttle body to front which is how i would need it. Adapter plate is probably the answer and just fit ST220 throttle body.
Eventually it will be using twin intakes like the rocketeer uses but just wanted a quick fix to get it up and running for now.
Thank you


CosKev3 - 21/4/19 at 09:51 AM

quote:
Originally posted by big_wasa
That will be why the jag jenveys arnt a bolt on fit then

Any one looked into the cyclone engine parts


Quick Google and engine looks quite abit different to the AJ30?

If I'm looking at correct one,came out in 2006?


MootchA - 24/4/19 at 08:45 PM

if the different inlet runners are now redundant and it's an open house, surely more air would flow if you took out the middle land area, the jag has no middle land at all. this may allow more fuel to be injected . ie. bigger bang etc !!


CosKev3 - 24/4/19 at 09:47 PM

quote:
Originally posted by MootchA
if the different inlet runners are now redundant and it's an open house, surely more air would flow if you took out the middle land area, the jag has no middle land at all. this may allow more fuel to be injected . ie. bigger bang etc !!


That would be a massive job,if you were going to do that it would be easier to fabricate a one off inlet from scratch!


RWD Focus - 25/4/19 at 06:16 PM

Anyone know of a tin/steel sump that will fit the AJ30 engine? Easier to make steel fit in my project than the aluminium one fitted as standard.
Or does anyone have any idea how much the rocketeer sump is? Ive asked them twice now and not got an answer.
If not it looks like tig welder is coming out.


sdh2903 - 25/4/19 at 06:33 PM

Bought my rocketeer sump a while back now so prices may have changed but was £350 with the baffle plate and oil pick up.


RWD Focus - 25/4/19 at 06:36 PM

Thank you, that's not as bad as i expected to be honest.

[Edited on 25/4/19 by RWD Focus]


RWD Focus - 14/5/19 at 06:55 PM

Anyone running a remote oil filter what size pipes are you running? i was thinking -10 (dash10) but didn't know if -12 would be better.
Anyone any ideas?
Thank you


Oddified - 14/5/19 at 07:48 PM

I have a remote oil filter and cooler fitted, using 5/8" hoses which is near as makes no odds an10. No issues at all.

Ian


CosKev3 - 15/5/19 at 05:56 AM

quote:
Originally posted by Oddified
I have a remote oil filter and cooler fitted, using 5/8" hoses which is near as makes no odds an10. No issues at all.

Ian


Yeah I've gone for AN10.

What have you done at the engine end to pipe it up?


RWD Focus - 15/5/19 at 06:22 AM

I’ve modified the jaguar housing, just going to weld an10 fittings into it, what bore of hose are you using? I was advised 9/16.


CosKev3 - 15/5/19 at 07:13 AM

quote:
Originally posted by RWD Focus
I’ve modified the jaguar housing, just going to weld an10 fittings into it, what bore of hose are you using? I was advised 9/16.


AN10 Teflon,so 9/16 yeah


RWD Focus - 15/5/19 at 07:28 AM

Just ordered some thanks for that


40inches - 15/5/19 at 07:54 AM

I used 1/2" npt fittings with 13mm bore rubber hose. Working well.
Description
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RWD Focus - 15/5/19 at 04:24 PM

Thank you