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Turbo Oil feed / return
aidan46 - 15/6/12 at 10:18 AM

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Dose anyone know the correct way to connect up the oil feed and return. I have an oil cooler , can it be connected in series with that some way? or dose it have to have a free flow return? Thanks. (its an 1990 zx10 engine)

pewe - 15/6/12 at 10:25 AM

The returns on the turbo production cars I've owned always goes directly back into the sump.
Worth checking that return pipe occasionally as they tend to cook & then split partic. the side nearest the turbo - ask me how I know!
HTH.
Cheers, Pewe10

imp paul - 15/6/12 at 10:29 AM

as above it should go strait back in to the sump

aidan46 - 15/6/12 at 10:31 AM

So that's the term free flow return ive come across?

MakeEverything - 15/6/12 at 10:33 AM

Yes, backl to the sump but it should be under gravity of as you say "Free Flow". Be careful with hoses. The renault 21 turbo guys have had a few fires because of split / perished hoses.

matt_gsxr - 15/6/12 at 10:50 AM

If you have the turbo super low like is often needed on a bike then you may need to pump it back up.

Some folk built mechanical pumps or you can get electrical versions.

aidan46 - 15/6/12 at 11:14 AM

yeah was wondering about that. if its free flow can it go in at the bottom of the sump or dose it have to enter higher and drain down? my installation the turbo is still above the line of the bottom of sump?

MakeEverything - 15/6/12 at 11:28 AM

The renault 21 has the return entering higher than the top of the sump.

MikeRJ - 15/6/12 at 12:27 PM

quote:
Originally posted by aidan46
yeah was wondering about that. if its free flow can it go in at the bottom of the sump or dose it have to enter higher and drain down? my installation the turbo is still above the line of the bottom of sump?


The return could go to the bottom of the sump, but the important point is the oil level within the sump which must be significantly lower than the drain point on the turbo under all conditions (e.g. including braking where the oil will surge to the front of the sump). If the oil can't drain away from the turbo bearing quickly and easily enough, then you will be performing a Red Arrows impression.

The drain pipe material is very important since the oil is extremely hot at this point. This is why turbo drain pipes on road cars to cost a fortune for what is effectively a short length of flexible pipe. Standard silicone hose is completely out, and even some of the fluoro-lined silicone hoses aren't rated for oil at very high temperatures.

aidan46 - 15/6/12 at 03:15 PM

I will be using it for racing for lot of oil sloshing around sump. Is it possible to pipe it back up to the rocker cover or somewhere like that?

MikeRJ - 15/6/12 at 03:37 PM

quote:
Originally posted by aidan46
I will be using it for racing for lot of oil sloshing around sump. Is it possible to pipe it back up to the rocker cover or somewhere like that?


Not without a pump since the oil won't be able to flow freely out of the turbo if it has to go uphill.

aidan46 - 15/6/12 at 03:59 PM

Gotcha now!.....is there any way of identifying the flow and return on Garrett turbos? mines from a 2001 saab 93.....i got it from a breakers yard so didnt see it being removed?

40inches - 15/6/12 at 04:30 PM

quote:
Originally posted by aidan46
Gotcha now!.....is there any way of identifying the flow and return on Garrett turbos? mines from a 2001 saab 93.....i got it from a breakers yard so didnt see it being removed?

On the 9-3 the turbo is the other way around, with the wastegate on the left, the oil return is the large bore hose that is facing the wrong way, I think you may have to turn the turbo round.
I will have a look at mine tomorrow, and see if I can get in to photo it.

[Edited on 15-6-12 by 40inches]

MikeRJ - 15/6/12 at 04:43 PM

You can normally loosen the turbine and compressor housings to align the parts as required (with the oil drain pointing vertically down). You may have to modify the wastegate actuator bracket after doing this however.

[Edited on 15/6/12 by MikeRJ]

PAUL FISHER - 15/6/12 at 05:05 PM

On my zx10r turbo (Velocity racing turbo kit) the oil feed came from the main oil gallery, there's a plug to remove, think it was 3/8 NPT, for the return to the sump, I drilled a hole as low as possible in the sump, used a pipe fiiting with dowty washes to seal it.

matt_gsxr - 15/6/12 at 05:09 PM

quote:
Originally posted by MikeRJ
You can normally loosen the turbine and compressor housings to align the parts as required (with the oil drain pointing vertically down). You may have to modify the wastegate actuator bracket after doing this however.

[Edited on 15/6/12 by MikeRJ]


If you take off the compressor section (alloy part) then there is a pin sticking out, remove the pin and now you can rotate the compressor (aka clocking) relative to the exhaust section.
more info here,
http://www.volvoforums.org.uk/showthread.php?t=150622

Be careful when you take it apart, the massive circlip can take an eye out, or more likely fly off somewhere out of sight.

Matt

aidan46 - 15/6/12 at 08:01 PM

Thanks lads. Id love to see some pictures of your zx10 Paul.

aidan46 - 17/6/12 at 11:16 AM

If I put the electric pump on the oil return line will it still be a free flow retun since it is being "pumped" back into sump?

PAUL FISHER - 17/6/12 at 01:16 PM

quote:
Originally posted by aidan46
Thanks lads. Id love to see some pictures of your zx10 Paul.



I did not have much luck with my zx10r turbo conversion, first engine did 200 miles before it melted a piston and second engine bent a rod, make sure you fit upgraded rods and pistons as the standard ones are made of plasticine ok in a bike, but can't take the extra stress in a car.
Also fit a good intercooler.
You need to speak to Sean "Indybird" on here, he bought my car from me in the end, and did a good job of getting it running well in the end, but don't expect it to last too long, I know Sean sold the car on, and believe the new owner blew it up at Oulton park, I think if I was doing it all again I would start with a Busa.

Here's a video of my first start up.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MHzSCh1k6U4&feature=my_favorites&list=FLFVhYyJ8l-7tyAOq6potitQ

Here's a video of Seans when he had worked his majic on the engine

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yqV3ipH-1X0&feature=results_main&playnext=1&list=PLACED24E4B74C743D

Here's a picture of the turbo and titainum manifold


[img] Rescued attachment specr 024 (Small).jpg
Rescued attachment specr 024 (Small).jpg [/img]

aidan46 - 17/6/12 at 01:46 PM

That sounds a bit worrying!!!........what sort of boost pressure were u running? Was it at standard compression?

PAUL FISHER - 17/6/12 at 01:53 PM

Only ran 6/7 psi, standard compression, thats what Velocity run on there stage 1 system.

INDY BIRD - 17/6/12 at 02:58 PM

Well I can say that a STD engine will be ok o around 6 psi max 4 psi would be better, anything after this as Paul said rods will need replacing, I replace rod pistons head gasket, valve are also a point o weakness 2 bent in Pauls engine,

We ran 9 psi and was fine the engine only gave up after 3500 mile as he new owner blewup on track well span a Bearing due to him not monitoring oil temp, killed it r a 20 plus lap stint at Oultan park,
Only him sl to blame othe than that it's all fine no and runs 340 bhp at 12 psi,

I can and pics or may be some in my archive I you take. Look,

I owl invest in an oil cooler though for sure,

I have some STD rods and pistons also in the garage in very good condition an may sell them on if neon interested?

Good luck,

Sean

MakeEverything - 17/6/12 at 03:03 PM

quote:
Originally posted by PAUL FISHER


Here's a video of Seans when he had worked his majic on the engine

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yqV3ipH-1X0&feature=results_main&playnext=1&list=PLACED24E4B74C743D


Love that.

aidan46 - 17/6/12 at 05:15 PM

Sorry lads if i hav'nt made it clear, my zx10 is the 1990 model.....i have it running it on zx6r throttle bodies with MS2 extra at the moment. The standard c/r is 11:1 and im using a good big oil cooler off a newholland tractor.

INDY BIRD - 17/6/12 at 08:10 PM

OH ok sorry about that, not sure about the olders zx10 so don't take any advice I've given as don't know if they are the same,

Good luck

aidan46 - 17/6/12 at 09:01 PM

Dose anybody know where I can get one of those electric oil pumps from. And how much should I pay for it?

matt_gsxr - 17/6/12 at 09:06 PM

FBM on oldskool suzuki can supply.

There are a few thread, but this one is a start.

http://forum.oldskoolsuzuki.info/cgi-bin/Yabb/YaBB.pl?num=1327063015/0

aidan46 - 20/6/12 at 08:48 PM

Should the oil supply line for the turbo be taken off the pipe going to the top end of the engine?

matt_gsxr - 20/6/12 at 09:00 PM

quote:
Originally posted by aidan46
Should the oil supply line for the turbo be taken off the pipe going to the top end of the engine?


That is what I have done. Replaced a double banjo bolt with a triple banjo bolt and plumbed in a hose to the turbo.
I am no expert though.