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2 Push Button Indicator Switches
TimEllershaw - 9/5/11 at 01:26 PM

Hi,

Has anybody used individual push buttons for their indicator switches ?

I’ve just got a set of Savage switches. The indicator switches are a pair of latching buttons.

Obviously I can wire them up as 2 completely separate circuits, nice and easy.

But that gives the possibility that both could be on at the same time. Is that a problem ??

I had (wrongly) assumed that the switches would be momentary push-to-make rather than latching, and had a couple of ideas for latching relays that would allow cancelling with either button, auto cancelling after a period of time...etc ...etc.


Just interested to hear what others have done, any thoughts appreciated.

Cheers

Tim.

Miks15 - 9/5/11 at 01:51 PM

cant you use the second bank of poles on the indicators so that the power for each switch goes through the other switch.

So that when your right indicator is pushed, the power lead to the left indicator switch is cut and vice versa

blakep82 - 9/5/11 at 01:55 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Miks15
cant you use the second bank of poles on the indicators so that the power for each switch goes through the other switch.

So that when your right indicator is pushed, the power lead to the left indicator switch is cut and vice versa


doesn't that then mean that when you push both, then neither work? should be easy to work out whats happening though.

Tim, there's nothing in the manual about how the switches work, or what type of switches, just that they work in the correct way. individual push buttons aren't a problem, there are a few on here i think wired up as 2 seperate buttons on the wheel. can't remember who, but i have seen them. if you can do some clever electrickery, then go for it! sounds like a good solution. theres a link to the manual below if you've not seen it before.

edit, greenie has something similar i think
Description
Description
although, he does also have the indicator stalks behind the wheel, but it looks like the green buttons on the wheel are for indicators? thats my take anyway

[Edited on 9/5/11 by blakep82]

RickRick - 9/5/11 at 02:09 PM

i sva'd with a cheap nasty stalk from cbs, it was too long too so had to be cut down all that fell off on the way home though bit traumatic but i've replaced it with non latching 2 way switch stuck to the back of the paddle shift seem to work ok

YQUSTA - 9/5/11 at 02:15 PM

Sorry to say but this will never work properly.

One way or the other you will allways have the ability to have both on or neither on if one is left on by mistake.

the problem as you have correctly identified is the 'latching' of the switch which can not be over come unless you can dismantle the switch to remove the feature.

MkIndy7 - 9/5/11 at 02:15 PM

Could you dismantle the latching bit out of the switch if you only wanted momentary?

Canada EH! - 9/5/11 at 02:20 PM

Use it to your advantage, no need for a Hazard switch.

David Jenkins - 9/5/11 at 02:27 PM

I once drove a Citroen that had push-button indicators - they were great big hard-to-miss buttons on bits of dashboard that stuck out each side of the speedo, just next to the wheel rim in front of your hands (assuming that you had your hands in the right position). Push once to start the indicator, push again to cancel (or push the other one to indicate the other way) - I can't remember if they self-cancelled. They were a total PITA.

If you put your switches on the dash, you'll have to take one hand off the wheel to press one of them (if you can find it without looking): if you're going round a roundabout then you'll take one hand off to indicate one way, put it back then take the other one off to indicate the other way. My bet is that after a while you'll not use them at all - a simple lever is so much easier.

Oh - and I don't think you'll find it easy to implement with latch switches - you would stand a chance with momentary ones though.

Krismc - 9/5/11 at 02:49 PM

quote:
Sorry to say but this will never work properly.

One way or the other you will allways have the ability to have both on or neither on if one is left on by mistake.

the problem as you have correctly identified is the 'latching' of the switch which can not be over come unless you can dismantle the switch to remove the feature.



Never say never, its simple and can work easily enough.

Im sure if i remember on my savage switch its the base(rear section) of the switch which causes the latching action and if you remove the back part you will see that it works momentary and cant latch, so if you remove the small collection pins for the latch and then refit it wont latch, on checking my switch i can see that it will work well as a momentary as there is around 4mm of follow through action so you wont burn the contacts out pushing it regularly, i often change the action of switchs to suit what i want as the office always order the wrong ones.

Ill send you a relay action timer if you wish?? then wire as above i.e put the opposite from each switch through the Normally closed Contact and wire in the action timer to the supply.

You with me?? then if you press switch, it wont latch but start a timer (say 4 seconds - goes to 90) and the other button will be disconnected(via earth) while opposite one is working, easy really but.....

When you sitting at lights the indicators wont stay on for long and wont latch, so then you will have to work out a small circuit if you want it too latch as well which will be more complicated (well simple really) or you could put the action relay timer adjuster on the dash and wind it up too hold it one and then wind it back to make it simples!!

Or you could add a 'latch' latching button, which overides the timer and keeps the feed alive until you depress/unlatch the switch. ill do a diagram if you need but its pretty easy.

[Edited on 9/5/11 by Krismc]

TimEllershaw - 9/5/11 at 03:01 PM

Thanks for the answers. I had thought about the cross-wiring idea, but can't see it being correct. As YQUSTA says, you always seem to get the option of both on or both off when you don't want them.

A little bit more Googleing suggests that MNR sold these switches as a pair. I'll see if I can find out how they had them wired.

I've also spotted a picture from sucksqueezebangblow who used them. I've sent him a u2u to ask is opinions.



idea #1:
these swithes come in 2 pieces the nice brushed aluminium "facia" and the "connector block". The connector block has all the wiring in and the latch mechanism. I'll see if I can get just a couple of momentary connector blocks from somewhere, or buy a couple of momentary switches and swap them around. ( if I get ones with no logo on I could probably use them somewhere else)

idea #2:
put the old switch back in. Not pretty, but it works. Probably more driver friendly (as per David Jenkins comments)
Could use the Savage switches just as lamps on dash.


Tim.

TimEllershaw - 9/5/11 at 03:08 PM

Thanks Krismc,

I'll have a closer look at them when I get home and see if I can de-latch them.

Thanks for the offer, I Think I'm happy with the timer / relay stuff, but I may ask you for circuit diagrams later when I can't get it to work

Tim.

[Edited on 9/5/2011 by TimEllershaw]

Krismc - 9/5/11 at 03:18 PM

This is a quick one ive just done without latch for you too keep you in right direction, its really simple to remove latch on the switch and simple too add a timer latch too keep the indicators going.



Edit to say,just before someone else jumps in, i know the switchs dont show all the contacts or the light wiring(that can be done afterwards) and the Timer doesnt show all the wiring for the feeds, it depends on the timer you use but is simple either way - ive used blue and green just as the wires cross and i cant draw on computer very well. and the green in green out, blue in blue out i know isnt the same electricary.


[Edited on 9/5/11 by Krismc]

Charlie_Zetec - 9/5/11 at 08:38 PM

I've got a signal dynamics device on my build - yet to get it going, but came after a recommendation and tryout of my friends' on his Westie. They did a group buy last summer, but they do appear on eBay from time to time.

I'm using two single momentary push-switches to run it, mounted on a bracket behind the steering wheel.

The unit;
Signal Dynamics indicator unit

Locostbuilders review

2p added!

Davey D - 10/5/11 at 09:10 AM

you can buy savage switches in both latching, and non latching configurations. my savage horn button, and my savage botton for my electric reverse are both non latching.

mad-butcher - 10/5/11 at 05:54 PM

I've just bought one of these at a bargain price off a forum member self canceling indicator
Thanks RickRick I bought the unit for when I decide to fit my own paddle, been struggling with how to mount to seperate switches on the wheel without the wires twisting. Never crossed my mind to mount the buttons on the paddle.

tony

ceebmoj - 16/2/12 at 03:52 PM

Thought I would resurrect this thread because I saw this very neat solution on the atom forum.

Very nice indicater solotion

loggyboy - 16/2/12 at 04:08 PM

I want one of those gadgets - that is top drawer stuff!