I want to convert my ZX9 engine to fuel injection, can someone explain to me in simple terms, what i would need to control the fuelling. I'm assuming i could retain the bike ecu to handle the ignition side.?
Please don't direct me to the megasquirt info pages, iv'e tried trawling through it, but after trying to decihiper all the different versions/options, i glazed over and lost the will to live
TIA
Al.


[Edited on 17/3/06 by Wadders]

If the MS pages are too tricky for you, then what you need is loads of money
Just pay someone else to do it for you.
Griffin or Emerald spring to mind.
MegaSquirt is the locost way but there is a pay off in time.

Right.

you will need a megasquirt unit, some injection throttle bodies c/w injectors, fuel rail and fuel pressure regulator(also connectors and wiring), a different fuel pump, and you will also need to mod your fuel system, to include a return to tank from your engine bay.

if you plan on using the car for track days or enthusiastic driving, you may need a fuel swirl pot to stop fuel starvation under heavy cornering/braking

you should be able to keep the bike ecu for spark control, or just use an upgraded megasquirt n spark unit to control the whole thing.

i may know of built up MS unit and some throttle bodies for sale aswell.

HTH

just noticed your in leeds, I'm in hull, so if you decide to go ahead and need any help, i could pop through and give you a hand.

Ray

[Edited on 17/3/06 by rayward]

[Edited on 17/3/06 by rayward]

wadders any particular reason for ditching the carbs? im going to run my v8 on r1 carbs and have bought an innovate wideband reader to get accurate afr readings on the road ,if its a driveability issue perhaps a spare set of main jets and some drills might be worth a shot?

Hi Froggy
to be fair she runs sweet on carbs, (thanks to Jack at Holeshot), but i have this nagging compulsion to graft on a blower, and reckon it will be easier to set up using injection.
V8 with R1 carbs sounds like fun, how are you mounting them, any pics


Originally posted by froggy
wadders any particular reason for ditching the carbs? im going to run my v8 on r1 carbs and have bought an innovate wideband reader to get accurate afr readings on the road ,if its a driveability issue perhaps a spare set of main jets and some drills might be worth a shot?

i reckon if you took blood samples from most people on this forum there must be a gene which makes you do this kind of thing cause its not normal is it?
the pic is from another guy whos allready done it on his mk and is chuffed with it,i know ms will be more accurate than carbs but as much as i get the principles i know il end up smashing it to bits when it comes to getting it to work,i bought a cracking book called maximum boost by corky bell its worth a read not too technical but everything you need for a diy job. the wideband reader is a top tool if yor thinking of a turbo
Rescued attachment CIMG0010.JPG

too right, maybe its all the fumes! loving that picture btw, awesome setup, are they bogg bros manifolds?
Heard a few good reviews on the corky bell book, i'll have a butchers on amazon. I bought the Joe Hale one which is quite informative but biased towards turbos.
If i can sort the drive out (which i think is feasible if i ditch the generator) i'm hoping to fit an eaton supercharger.


Originally posted by froggy
i reckon if you took blood samples from most people on this forum there must be a gene which makes you do this kind of thing cause its not normal is it?
the pic is from another guy whos allready done it on his mk and is chuffed with it,i know ms will be more accurate than carbs but as much as i get the principles i know il end up smashing it to bits when it comes to getting it to work,i bought a cracking book called maximum boost by corky bell its worth a read not too technical but everything you need for a diy job. the wideband reader is a top tool if yor thinking of a turbo

mini blower by any chance?

You got it



Originally posted by froggy
mini blower by any chance?

The biggest hurdle you will have to overcome is a trigger wheel for the ECU.

Bike Engines use non-standard signalling patterns.

Speak to LSDWeb - he's currently undergoing this headache.

LOL I have this worry with my next grasser. I have spoke to Froggy on U2U as I suspected that he had the blood disorder mentioned above!!!!

I will be using a pair of V-twins, hopefully TL1000's if I can find two gooduns, and the injection will need remapping, due to airbox removal etc and my desire to get some more urge out of them by changing cams and messing with ports, as I think they will be a bit short in std form, really could do with 140hp each out of them as a minimum.

I see that remapping of the std ECU is mentioned by a few bike tuners, but is this proper remapping or 2d mapping with a piggyback thing like a power commander? I assume that the power commander is 2d mapped isn't it? If so I am not keen on that idea!

I guess I need to speak to TTS or Holeshot but just fishing for ideas on here!

[Edited on 20/3/06 by NS Dev]

nat i wouldnt discount using the tl motor in stock form as my tl was quicker than my mates r1 and zx10 at a track day at donnington last year (it was pissing down though)i spoke to jack at holeshot and he thought that the tl crank was the weakpoint and didnt recommend any type of forced induction on it.
wadders,ive been thinking about your idea and although its not impossible you still have the problem of gearing the blower to run with the bike engines huge rev range. if the blower on the mini makes 10 psi at 6000 rpm how much faster will it stand being spun? i doubt the turbo bike engines do much more boost than that running 9.5 + cr.it looks like turbo is the way to go as if a blower was a goer it would have been done by now i hope you ignore this as everyone told me my tl motor wouldnt fit in the back of my kitten

Blower has been done Froggy, but it was a centrifugal one (vortech type) not positive displacement.

Andrew Varey, who used to feature in Walkers Workshop in CCC mag a lot, runs one on a busa in a sportscar of some sort.

TTS's take on it:

TTS Busa Charger

hardly locost though?
nat how much do these plumbers blocks cost? say i wanted to do what your doing and run a de-dion with two tl,s driving a solid shaft with splined ends to take ford cv,s. just curious as mines in now but for future ref how much for the drive setup minus engines?

[Edited on 21/3/06 by froggy]

no, definitely not locost!!!

The bearings are dirt cheap, couldn't tell you a price off the top of my head but cheap enough for you not to have to worry. The shafts are the more expensive bit, with the countershaft being the bit that is nagging at me.

Not sure exactly how I am going to attach the CV's yet. Need a flange somewhere, but then need to get the counterhaft through the bearings as well!

PS the setups I have seen usually involved popping the bearings onto the shaft then welding the drive flanges on afterwards, but I don't really like that idea!

[Edited on 21/3/06 by NS Dev]

You could well be right Froggy, Its fairly uncharted territory, but according to eaton, its safe to spin them to 14,000rpm, so i'm willing to give it a go. Theres a company advertising in PPP, that make spacer plates to lower the cr, so with a decent intercooler and maybe water/alky injection 10psi might be ok.

Originally posted by froggy

wadders,ive been thinking about your idea and although its not impossible you still have the problem of gearing the blower to run with the bike engines huge rev range. if the blower on the mini makes 10 psi at 6000 rpm how much faster will it stand being spun? i doubt the turbo bike engines do much more boost than that running 9.5 + cr.it looks like turbo is the way to go as if a blower was a goer it would have been done by now i hope you ignore this as everyone told me my tl motor wouldnt fit in the back of my kitten

if the generator isnt oil bathed then you could machine a pulley to replace it and drive the blower with an alternator as the tensioner?

That's the plan, hoping i can machine a blanking plate with an oil seal to fit on the crankcase behind the pulley, only done some rough measurments, but i think the crank will stick out enough to mount a pulley in place of the genny, and as you say it shouldn't be too hard to mount a small car alternator. Hardest bit is running the drive without fouling anything, i need to completely redesign the engine cradle for a start.


Originally posted by froggy
if the generator isnt oil bathed then you could machine a pulley to replace it and drive the blower with an alternator as the tensioner?

i suppose the logical place to put it is where the carbs sit and fab a simple log manifols to place the injectors between the head and the blower with a car throttle body into the charger, sounds like a plan to me, theres a firm near ne ferriday engineering who do decompression plates but any laser cutting firm will take a template from the original gasket and do you a copper version