jeffw
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| posted on 4/8/09 at 09:13 PM |
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English Axle
Right....axle is off the car and everthing on the diff is undone but...
How do you get the drum brakes off to release the drive shafts ??? There is a plate with two big holes in it in the centre of the drum, do I need a
special tool to release it ?
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mookaloid
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| posted on 4/8/09 at 09:29 PM |
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Never done an English axle but I think there will be 4 bolts holding the brake backplate to the axle tube. If you take those out they will be holding
the bearing in place and then you should be able to pull the half shaft out.
I think .............
Edited to correct spellings
[Edited on 4/8/09 by mookaloid]
"That thing you're thinking - it wont be that."
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jeffw
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| posted on 4/8/09 at 09:38 PM |
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Your probable right....but how do I take the drum brake cover off to be able to get at the heads of the bolts ?
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tul214
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| posted on 4/8/09 at 09:46 PM |
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backplatesm
On my atlas axle you need to remove all the brake gubins and then undo the 4 bolts (2 arrowed).
Then the fun begins.... you ideally need a slide hammer to pull the half shafts out but it can be done by winding a couple of bolts through the
flange.
Once the shafts are out the back plate will come off and the diff can be pulled out of the axle. Remember to number the shafts, i.e. left and right so
they go back in the same sides.
Mark.
[Edited on 4/8/09 by tul214]
[Edited on 4/8/09 by tul214]
1.6 Raw Super6 sold
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clairetoo
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| posted on 4/8/09 at 09:47 PM |
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If you mean the drum itself , it's only held on by the wheel - and probably a wear ridge on the drum 
Give a few good taps around the edge with a soft mallet , it may need a bit of a levering to pull it off the shoes.......
Its cuz I is blond , innit
Claire xx
Will weld for food......
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dickie b
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| posted on 4/8/09 at 09:55 PM |
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Have just rebuilt the english axle on my Fury..
The back plate(s) are only removable once the half-shaft(s) are out. The four-bolt plate is all you need to remove before you can use a slide hammer
to drag out the half-shafts.
There isnt any other component - so not sure what you mean by 'drum brake cover', apart from the drum itself?
One word of advice - If you buy new bearing/oil seal then you should just ream out / enlarge the centre of the back plate. The new bearings have an
(improved) oil seal around their circumfrence to prevent leakage. The backplate centre hole becomes too tight to fit over teh increased diameter of
these 'new' bearings, but five minutes with a rotary file / grind wheel should solve the problem.
Use plenty of grease when you push them back in to avoid damaging the seal..
Hope this helps?
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jeffw
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| posted on 5/8/09 at 05:25 AM |
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Ahhhh...light bulb goes on.
The studs go through the drum not attached to it. I'll hit it with my favourite rubber mallet later
So as I have in pieces....how difficult is it to change to discs
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Peteff
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| posted on 5/8/09 at 08:10 AM |
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Hit the drum round the brake shoes with a real hammer, a rubber one will do nothing. Then give the mounting face between each of the wheel studs a
couple of good whacks as well till you see it break the rust seal between the drum and the flange. It should be able to move forward now with some
prising and probably a bit of brute force and ignorance.
yours, Pete
I went into the RSPCA office the other day. It was so small you could hardly swing a cat in there.
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MikeRJ
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| posted on 5/8/09 at 08:33 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Peteff
Hit the drum round the brake shoes with a real hammer, a rubber one will do nothing.
The rubber "dead blow" hammers are superb for this application, and minimise any risk of damage.
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Dangle_kt
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| posted on 5/8/09 at 09:10 AM |
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If toy are anthring like me you wil have a pig of job getting the dam drum back over the shoe! I discovered there is a lever on the back of the plate
that with some persuesion can be moved to make the drums drop in ever so slightly. Enouh to get the drum back on anyway.
Have fun. And if you haven't one, bit a slide hammer. 100% easier!
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dickie b
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| posted on 5/8/09 at 09:47 AM |
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Hi Jeff
Found an ancient copy of 'Which Kit' that had a reader's letter that questioned the method of converting to rear discs on live axle
Sylvas..
From memory the response was along the lines of:
"blah blah... we spoke to Jermey Phillips ... his sylva cars have won kit car championship for x years all using drum brakes... he dismisses
the conversion as being totally unneccesary in such a lightweight car.. etc "
Mind you, the magazine is over ten years old (!) but I reckon his opinion is probably still valid on why drums are perfectly ok for the job
rear discs do look rather snazzy though..
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02GF74
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| posted on 5/8/09 at 10:27 AM |
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... been there, done that...
removing the drum is the same as any other drum, except maybe Land Rovers as they have a couple of small countersunk screws to hold the drum in
place.
ensure the hand brake is off and try to keep the drum square as you pull it off. sometimes levering between drum and back plate will help.
rotate the drum and perservere - sometimes you have to push the drum back in and repeat - it is all a matter of creating clearance between the shoes
and the drum itself.
to pull the half shafts out
if the seals leak - as seen by drops of oil on the inside of the wheel - it makes good sense to replace the bearings.
to remove, introduce them to the angry grinder or try to crack them with a hammer/chisel.
to refit, warm up in bath of warm engine oil, about 100 C, put the drive ends in bath of iced water then drift on - the oil/water is to
expand/contract the metal for easier fit - not sure if that is entirely necessary.
likewise with the collar, I put it on small BBQ to heat up to much higher temp and again drift on.
the bearing is directional - the inner range has a flange lip on one side - this goes outwards - so make sure get it on right and make sure the
cover plate is on as well!
re pening out the axle - I would disagree.
I found the replacement bearing had groove and o-ring fitted and it is very difficult to fit without damaging the o-ring - don't ask how I know
that fact.
The trick is to be patient and use as small screwdriver to try to poke the seal into place - easier said than done as you need to support the whole
gubbins plus access is restricted - it did take a stupidly long amount of time but the reward is no more drips.
if you are local, I have big F.O. square tube that I used to drift the stuff on - when fitting the bearing, make sure you hit the inner race - I think
this stands proud of the over race but not 100% sure.
The collar is the only think that stops the wheel from coming off - some folks apply a blob of weld or 2 to hold it to the axle; my shafts were like
that and although it makes it a bit harder to remove since you need to grind them off, I did the same.
when refitting, make sure the brake adjuster moving bits all move freely and then use a piece of wood to tap the serated adjuster bit back in - this
is the minimum adjustment positon and will allow the drums to slide over new shoes - applying handbrake will auto adjust.
oh, forgot - the disc vs drum debate... someone posted weight and the drums are lighter - bear in mind your car is 1/2 the original donor weight so
the drums are more than capable and there is not need to come up with a contraption for hand brake.
finally take photo of borth sides after removing the drum to show how the springs are fitted - maybe mark the spriong ends and what the hang onto with
cololur paint - it seems obvious when you take them off but not so when it comes to refitting. likewise do one side at at time as you have the other
one as reference.
[Edited on 5/8/09 by 02GF74]
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dickie b
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| posted on 5/8/09 at 11:00 AM |
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Yup - that is the best advice you will find on rebuilding the drums & bearing of the english axle.
( Just to clarify - I found I had no choice but to slightly increase the centre hole dia on the back plate to enable the bearing (with oil seal) to
pass through when the whole shebang is slid into the casing. Only a few mm all round, thats all)
The axle casing itself is left well alone.
ta
richard
P.S - I got my local garage to press the new bearings onto the halfshafts - only charged five pound to do both. Dont forget to put the four-bolt plate
on first!
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grub
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| posted on 5/8/09 at 12:22 PM |
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AND HOW MUCH OIL DO YOU THINK YOU WILL NEED WHEN ORDERING
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02GF74
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| posted on 5/8/09 at 06:24 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by dickie b
( Just to clarify - I found I had no choice but to slightly increase the centre hole dia on the back plate to enable the bearing (with oil seal) to
pass through when the whole shebang is slid into the casing. Only a few mm all round, thats all)
gotcha - that makes sense - I had read it as you had to open out the axle!!!
the back plate should pass over the bearing and you can pop the o-ring off then replace it once the plate is through - cannot remember having to do
that but .......
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