Whilst researching my build, a came across pictures on the web of someone who had got around the lower BJ issue on a Sierra by cutting off the BJ from the cast steel lower arm and welding it to the wishbones. Is this possible or advisable? At the risk of seeming tight (even on a Locost site!), it would help me as it is difficult for me to get to MK/Luego to get the lower BJ socket machined.

Not sure that it's a very robust solution and it looks as though the hub has been mounted back to front with the steering arm to the rear. Might prove difficult to get the castor angle accurate as well.

Nick

Surely the heat may damage the BJ. If you could do it, perhaps by welding further away from the BJ, or even by fixing it to the wish bone using the existing fixing points, would the BJ be capable of taking the load from the suspension?

RPS, Sorry I dont mean to hijack the post, but might be relevent and it's a question I have been wondering.

Which lower BJ should be used with the Sierra uprights & standard wishbones?

Simon

is your life worth a trip to get your hubs bored out?

atb

steve

I think you're probably right, but the car passed the SVA though! Probably had some foam stuck on it to protect pedestrians.

lower arms are cast iron not steel,i wouldnt wana be in that car

I know the caliper looks to be but is that a Sierra upright? Only ask as the top BJ part doesn't look right.

Or maybe just too much pinkbits.com has sent me blind.

Either way I wouldn't get in that car! Looks like an accident waiting to happen!

Apologies to the builder if they're reading this.

Cheers,

James

RPS, you could possibly post your uprights?

Strip them down so they're light (as possible!) for posting and do it that way.

Will cost you a few more quid but might be worth it.

Or else- find some Astra BJs that fit. People here have apparently gone that route. Take your hub down to the motor factors and try the BJs till an Astra one fits.

HTH,

James

out of interest, what happens if you weld to cst iron? does it get brittle or summat?

atb

steve

parcelforce will send a 30 kilo parcel for about 10 quid from any main post office.

atb

steve

As a general rule, I steer clear (like the pun?) of welding anything cast. Even if it looks ok. it often breaks next to the weld.

That's why I was suprised to see someone had done it. I thought that they must know something that I don't.

Thanks for your views, back to plan 'A'.

we decided to use go down the astra joint , ones of a mk 2 astra fit perfectly

i have bin told not to weld cast iron if at all possable as it becomes brittle
and i dont want to think about a brittle bottom ball joint when you stamp on the brakes
i think joel p has used some astra ball joints that fit sierras
good luck with the build dave

i havent myself, i just asked about it a while ago! just got MK to bore them in the end, was an easy and pleasant experience.

plus theres an old abbey nearby, which is good for a quite hour or two...

ps nice to know the astra ones do fit.

[Edited on 5/1/04 by JoelP]

Why not do away with those ugly, heavy cast monstrosities, and just bung a neat round press-in balljoint into a cup welded to the bottom wishbone. There are bound to be dozens of suitable balljoints...just make sure you pick a bottom one.
It would also make the wishbone jig a lot easier to set up, and a hell of a lot more accurate too.

Rorty, sounds interesting, could you elaborate a bit please? What is a press in balljoint, how do they work, what are the specifications and where can I get them from?

Kingr

Dunno about welds falling off & the heat taking out the lube & seals but putting front hubs on backwards will shaft the ackerman geometry big style. Good for makin squealing noises in carparks.....
Bob C

if the sierra hubs are like the granada - which i think is so - there is no ackerman - the steer arms point straight back and dont intersect anywhere......


atb

steve

is the top ball joint a rod end on its side?

Steve, if you look closely at the piccy of Bobs foot-er-upright, you can see that the steering arm is in approximately the same plane as the bottom ball joint. As the top ball joint is further towards the car, the imaginary centre line of the hub movement is also closer to the car than the pivot of the track rod, giving some of the Ackermann principle....



wisbones on correct way with hub leaning back

[Edited on 6/1/04 by Stu16v]

yep - you are right

have to take another look at my abs granny hubs - thought they have none at all. But I could well be wrong.

yes - the top joint in the pic is a rod end on side - which I have read can be done.

Rod ends are best side loaded - which that one would be. The main load is taken on the bottom bones.

a decent rod end might just be better than a transit drag link end, which wasnt intended to live life like that either....

atb

steve

kingr:

quote:

---

sounds interesting, could you elaborate a bit please? What is a press in balljoint, how do they work, what are the specifications and where can I get them from?

---

Rescued attachment balljoint_VW_bottom02.jpg

is there a specific one that fits a sierra taper? what holds them in, is it just a good fit or is it clamped? thanks!

£8 from the local motor factors delivered!

Haven't measured it yet, but it seems to be a good fit.

Thanks for the tip, I reckon that will save me at least £40-£50.

RPS

Sorry about the picture quality, I've only got a cheap webcam (notice a trend here!)

[Edited on 7/1/04 by RPS]
Rescued attachment Image004.jpg

No idea if it would be the right size on the taper but Rover 800's use a press fit ball joint of the type Rorty mentions - about £15 from a local factor.

JoelP:

quote:

---

what holds them in, is it just a good fit or is it clamped?

---

Rescued attachment lower_balljoint.gif

thanks Rorty! just been to the QHA website, they have many catalogues to download, unfortunately the steering and suspension section isnt online!! worth a try though!

anyone know where to find a comprehensive list of BJ tapers online!?

been doin a bit of research with a few of the sierra people on interford, and the conclusion is that the TCA's are made of forged steel - perfectly safe to weld to and strong aswell.

if they were made of cast iron, then under normal sierra driving conditions, if you hit a bump they'd shatter or fracture. - not good! so they made them out of forged steel to give them a bit of bend and lots of strength

RPS,

Do you have a link for the website of your first picture?

Cheers,

James

Kingr and everyone else

Rorty is spot on with the beetle stuff. The press in BJ's are really tough and seem to last nearly forever- I only recently had to change them on my 30 year old, 150k mile bug!

The tie rod end looks like a slightly scaled down version of the transit drag link end- its M14 threaded. It also seems to last an ice age (on the bug anyway!).

For this reason I'm looking into using it with a mondeo upright- but thats another story... lol

chris

James,

The web site for the original picture is:

http://www.wurlyvalve.i12.com/

RPS

Rorty, some questions & sorry if I`ve missed the answers earlier.
Is the VW ball joint compatible with a cortina front upright do you know?
What thickness & depth is the ring that this mounts in on the wishbone, is it just miid steel ?
Thanks, Steve.

has anyone got some lolocost wishbones as they seemed to have a bottom ball joint like the beetle one

Steve Hnz, I don't know what the Cortina taper angle/ratio is, but the VW bottom balljoint is 1:12. I suspect the Cortina will be inline with other Fords, and will be 1:8. There are bound to be other similar balljoints around with a 1:8 taper, as it's one of the most common (GM use it too).
If you let me have your email address, I'll send you a drawing of what's required.
It's basicaly just a mild steel stepped ring, turned from seamless pipe or round bar.

Rorty, you`re right, 1:8 they are, many thanks. See U2U for email address, Steve.

Hi all,

The picture at the start of the thread is of my car, and is my upright!

The uprights are in fact forged steel and weld up fine and strong. Gave them a serious bashing with a sledge hammer before I drove it anywhere! Further to that it has been crashed twice at Chivenor, both times smacking the front left wheel, and emerged unscathed. As well as me using the banks several times at Wiscombe to keep the car straight(ish) through the esses.
As for ackermann, humm, well that wasn't the best. The arms are pretty straight so I have no ackermann at the moment. Sort that out soon.
Castor is fine.
SVA was fine, with some common sense using bits of rubber.

And for all those not wishing to be in my car, that is fine too. Having taken a class win at St Eval on its second outing my share drives are chosen very carefully, thankyou.

www.wurlyvalve.i12.com

[Edited on 13/2/04 by wurlyvalve]