steve m
|
| posted on 14/7/16 at 07:50 PM |
|
|
power steering in a 7 ?
Firstly, I am not joking when I ask the question, but is there a kit of parts, or anything that could be suitably mounted to a xflow, that would give
me power steering on my locost ?
I have a serious right shoulder problem, from breaking my arm last year, that may result in a replacement shoulder, and until I know more, I may not
be able to use the locost much, as currently and driving of more than 30 mins, means im in agony for the following week
I had changed the old 13" steering wheel to a 14" and that had helped, and over the next few days, will experiment with bring the wheel
closer to me, to avoid the straight arm out driving position, but apart from that, im stumped !
any idea's ?
steve
Thats was probably spelt wrong, or had some grammer, that the "grammer police have to have a moan at
|
|
|
|
|
tegwin
|
| posted on 14/7/16 at 07:56 PM |
|
|
Grab an electric power steering unit from a Corsa... you can get a little module that plugs in so it thinks its in the corsa and away you go!
Should fit inline on the steering column between the wheel and the rack.
[Edited on 14/7/16 by tegwin]
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Would the last person who leaves the country please switch off the lights and close the door!
www.verticalhorizonsmedia.tv
|
|
|
steve m
|
| posted on 14/7/16 at 08:04 PM |
|
|
Thanks, and that looks interesting, although in its current state, would be a pita to fit in my scuttle
steve
Thats was probably spelt wrong, or had some grammer, that the "grammer police have to have a moan at
|
|
|
froggy
|
| posted on 14/7/16 at 08:24 PM |
|
|
Don't bother with corsa stuff , heavy and gear driven so you have to deal with the drag when you don't need any assistance . Suzuki wagon
or Vauxhall Agila is clutch drive and you can feed an rpm and speed signal from a vr sensor to make it speed sensitive . Wagon system is a lot more
compact than the corsa with the ecu fixed onto the motor .
I have a v8 in my car and wanted some comforts like power brakes and steering , works really well as assistance is full at parking speed and once
above 30/40mpg it's off and only works off the torque sensor input .
[IMG]http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r187/froggy_0[IMG]
|
|
|
rj
|
| posted on 15/7/16 at 11:33 AM |
|
|
Also worth having a play with toe settings, when I got mine on the road this spring the steering was very light, - I didn't like it that way, I
think it was toeing in, set it to toe out, lot more weight to the steering now. Could be a very quick/cheep fix for you
|
|
|
coozer
|
| posted on 15/7/16 at 01:09 PM |
|
|
Pug 106 has an electric hydraulic system. Basically an electric pump mated to a normal hydraulic rack.
Corsa epas column is very heavy. Toyota corrola epas is lighter and more advanced.
1972 V8 Jago
1980 Z750
|
|
|
owelly
|
| posted on 15/7/16 at 03:14 PM |
|
|
What Froggy said.... ^^^ ;-)
http://www.ppcmag.co.uk
|
|
|
locost7-online.com
|
| posted on 15/7/16 at 06:17 PM |
|
|
Rally design do a mk2 escort power steering rack
Locost Xflow 150bhp injected! Sold :-(
Facebook blog https://www.facebook.com/Johns-Tiger-Avon-Build-814223212056368/
PLEASE NOTE THIS MEMBER IS NOT A TRADER.
|
|
|
Nickp
|
| posted on 15/7/16 at 06:28 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by locost7-online.com
Rally design do a mk2 escort power steering rack
Really? Got a link?
|
|
|
locost7-online.com
|
| posted on 15/7/16 at 06:33 PM |
|
|
http://www.rallydesign.co.uk/product_info.php?cPath=900_2111&products_id=15325
Locost Xflow 150bhp injected! Sold :-(
Facebook blog https://www.facebook.com/Johns-Tiger-Avon-Build-814223212056368/
PLEASE NOTE THIS MEMBER IS NOT A TRADER.
|
|
|
Nickp
|
| posted on 15/7/16 at 06:35 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by locost7-online.com
http://www.rallydesign.co.uk/product_info.php?cPath=900_2111&products_id=15325
Ahhh right, but that's a power column not a power steering rack.
|
|
|
locost7-online.com
|
| posted on 15/7/16 at 06:37 PM |
|
|
Sorry yeah your are right I didn't look that close, thought it was too good to be true!
Locost Xflow 150bhp injected! Sold :-(
Facebook blog https://www.facebook.com/Johns-Tiger-Avon-Build-814223212056368/
PLEASE NOTE THIS MEMBER IS NOT A TRADER.
|
|
|
froggy
|
| posted on 15/7/16 at 07:33 PM |
|
|
It's also permanently powered with a little pot to vary assistance and rpm simulator so not speed sensitive . I've done several
conversions on Motorhomes with corsa bits and you end up with pretty numb steering to have enough assistance at low speed .
I have a corsa set up in my reliant with the sine wave feed from the Saab gearbox fed into a Saab speedo head which converts it to a digital signal
that the corsa b / c ecu can read to make it work properly .
The Agila / wagon r takes the pulse signal direct into the ecu so a vr signal from a gearbox sensor or as I've done using a ford crank sensor
picking up off the bolt heads on the onboard driveshaft flange on the diff giving a pulse per mile of 4000 into a vdo aftermarket speedo and split the
feed off into the epas ecu .
I couldn't work out what the ppm rate would be in a wagon r or Agila but it seems to be somewhere near as the steering weights up above 40 mph
and you can palm the wheel from lock to lock with the car stationary . I managed to get water in the ecu after leaving the car outside overnight and
it's no fun manoeuvring it without the epas
[IMG]http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r187/froggy_0[IMG]
|
|
|
rachaeljf
|
| posted on 15/7/16 at 09:54 PM |
|
|
Hi Froggy, don't suppose you have a handy wiring diagram? 
|
|
|
froggy
|
| posted on 15/7/16 at 11:44 PM |
|
|
Basically you need a perm 30a supply and a switched 12v ig feed plus rpm and vehicle speed to the main plug . There are a couple of redundant wires
left over for the epas ecu fault codes to be accessed but they won't stop it working.
The ecu isn't sealed so it needs going over with a hot glue gun or silicone to stop the board getting wet or you can unbolt it from the column
and move it out of the way
You need the whole assembly with upper column and lower link to the rack to have enough parts to make it work and the upper part has a sleeved section
that you can add to your existing upper column and mount your outer sleeve onto the stub of the original . It all makes sense once you strip it down ,
think I got my system for £70 out of an Agila and respect due to owelly for doing it first and giving me the idea
[Edited on 15/7/16 by froggy]
[Edited on 15/7/16 by froggy]
[IMG]http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r187/froggy_0[IMG]
|
|
|
rachaeljf
|
| posted on 16/7/16 at 12:06 AM |
|
|
Fantastic, many thanks for that Froggy, and Owelly.
Locostbuilders - is there anything it can't do?!
|
|
|
britishtrident
|
| posted on 16/7/16 at 07:36 AM |
|
|
There is an easy Locost way to convert the signal from an inductive (passive) wheel speed sensor into a 0v-12v square wave just use the ignition
module from an 1980's or early 1990's engine such as a Metro or MK3 Escort although a module from a Corsa would probably be neater.
To convert the 0v-12v square wave to 0v-5V I would just use a couple of ressistors as a voltage devider.
The wiring is very simple: Sensor ve, Sensor -ve , Ground, +12v Supply and Signal Out
Ford Fiesta Escort Orion Mk I II III IV Ignition Module 6153380 84SF12K057AA 9AA
Ford Fiesta Escort Orion Mk I II III IV Ignition Module 6153380 84SF12K057AA 9AA
[I] “ What use our work, Bennet, if we cannot care for those we love? .”
― From BBC TV/Amazon's Ripper Street.
[/I]
|
|
|
Phil_1471
|
| posted on 16/7/16 at 09:49 AM |
|
|
We use the Corsa stuff on rally cars. It's quiet popular and reliable and you will find there are a few people that sell refurb'd kits for
this reason.
You can live in a car but can't rally a house
|
|
|
MikeRJ
|
| posted on 16/7/16 at 10:18 AM |
|
|
Just remember that with all these power columns, a significant amount of stress is applied through the mountings so they must to be made robust enough
to deal with this. Having a power column rip itself out of it's mounts could really spoil your day.
|
|
|
topcatproduction
|
| posted on 29/12/16 at 11:20 PM |
|
|
Froggy- do you know the reason for requiring an RPM input with the Agila/Wagon R column? Also are the newer Agila columns the same to your knowledge
as the Wagon R ones are mostly around 15 years old on ebay now...
Thanks very much, TC
|
|
|
froggy
|
| posted on 30/12/16 at 02:26 PM |
|
|
The rpm signal just tells the epas Ecu that the engines running . I've been using the corsa and now the wagon r agila stuff for a while and
never had one fail or give problems as they're all made by Mitsubishi . I bought a spare agila Column for my seven only because the wagons etc
weren't as common as the corsa so I've got a spare if they all get crushed .
As far as the type of speed signal for the agila I'm pretty sure it's the sine wave from the vr sensor I use on the diff as the signal is
split as it goes to the speedo straight into the epas Ecu . On the corsa column in my other car the vr signal from the gearbox is fed into a speedo
head from the Saab Which converts it to digital then into the Saab Ecu and epas Ecu .
[IMG]http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r187/froggy_0[IMG]
|
|
|
Phil_1471
|
| posted on 30/12/16 at 07:25 PM |
|
|
All for corsa B - I'm pretty sure that the rpm emulator is a square wave. couple of things to watch out for if using them are, if your voltage
drops below 12.3v then the ECU shuts down, which is pretty annoying and you need to weld the part that's held inpalce with resin (some safety
feature on them 🙄 Which often brakes allowing the column to turn not doing anything- which is pretty scary.
Phil
You can live in a car but can't rally a house
|
|
|
topcatproduction
|
| posted on 30/12/16 at 09:22 PM |
|
|
Thanks for the reply. It would be simpler if it was a straight forward 12v input for the engine signal, can I use a chip to emulate the sine or
square wave and wire a second one with a resistor in for the assistance level? I've heard the ebay £30 boxes can be a bit crude, I'd
rather set it to a minimal level or wire it properly to change with wheel speed than use the "pot box".
Sorry to be cheeky but I don't suppose you know the weight of the column too? I saw that the Corsa B column is approx 7.4kg which is a bit of a
lump.
|
|
|
Phil_1471
|
| posted on 30/12/16 at 09:39 PM |
|
|
7kgs sounds about right, and why would you want your steering changing at different speeds??- designed really for low speed around car parks on road
cars. The emulators on eBay work fine just make sure to seal them, mentioned previously I think. These allow adjustment with a potentiometer that
changes the speed of the pulse provided to the steering ECU.
You can live in a car but can't rally a house
|
|
|
topcatproduction
|
| posted on 30/12/16 at 10:26 PM |
|
|
I'm building a race car and would rather not have any PAS however I'd probably regret it after 20 minutes of wrestling! So, looking to fit
an EPAS column but at high speed I'll only need minimal (if any) assistance whereas it would be nice at low speed. I'm still tempted to
fit nothing to start with and see how manageable the car is, but it's nice to have a plan from the beginning!
*Meant to say on all standard cars with an EPAS system the amount of assistance varies with speed, more at low speed and less the faster you go.
[Edited on 30/12/16 by topcatproduction]
|
|
|
